Business Day (Johannesburg)
10 November 2008
IN SPITE of SA saying it would take a tough line in a weekend summit to salvage Zimbabwe's power-sharing negotiations, the parties failed to put aside their differences at heated talks in Sandton last night.
[ See Article ]
So these SADC leaders want Tsvangirai to share 'Home Affairs' with Mugabe after Mugabe has gotten 'Defence' and 'Internal Security'? It is clear to all now that SADC supposes that the MDC is a junior partner to ZANU (PF)in the envisaged inclusive government. Howelse can someone think that what we are witnessing is an indeed powersharing of equal partners? I think Tsvangirai is right to reject this arrangement. Tsvangirai should now appeal the matter to AU before taking it to where we all want it to go (the UN). We know that taking the matter to the AU full of unelected dictators like Gaddaffi of Lybia could be a waste of time as the AU is an even more worthless organisation than SADC but procedure and precedence mean that AU should hear it first before the UN. I was also not happy with the dictatorial tone of the SADC Secretary General, Dr Salomao. Dr Salomao must be under no illussion that he can force his beliefs on Tsvangirai. Zimbabweans elected their leaders on March 29, 2008 and Mugabe lost the elections. Mugabe is only at the helm because of his control of coercive forces in the country such as the Army, the Police, the Secrete Police, the Party Militia and other rogue elements. I am also disgusted by Kgalema Motlante and Jacob Zuma of South Africa. The two South African leaders rumbled like thunder before the summit but we did not see any lightning from them. Why can't these African leaders ditch the eighty five year old Mugabe? Is Mugabe using African magic against them or it's just shear cowardice on their part.
maricho at the outset there is nothing called "african magic". magic is an ancient tradition practiced globally.
as for morgan and his mdc team this could have been a gracefully exit for Bob had he been wise enough to read between lines and see beyond the curtain.
Africans we need to know more than what has been protrayed on TV about African Leaders. Here is a picture of what is really behind the noise about Mugabe. Its about anyone who stands up against the West, who think its the right to taken and run Africa and its resources. A direct sign was demonstrated for us, when The UK Foreign Secretary Miliband and his French Counterpart, went into DRC, without following the protocol, as they went to represent EU and their investments. Please read the following and please see what is really behind the scenes. Tsvangirai seems to be telling all Africans that their decisions are not important unless the EU and UN have the last say.
When the forces of Uganda's President Yoweri Museveni overran eastern Zaire in October 1996, under the guidance of Baroness Lynda Chalker, the head of Britain's Overseas Development Office, this military phase was the culmination of an invasion of Zaire which had been ongoing for the past three years: the theft of Zaire's wealth and patrimony. Zaire, as a nation, is being dismembered. Its various energy-rich provinces, including Shaba and Kivu, are being encouraged to form separate micro-states. Already, because of the economic dislocation forced on Zaire over the past seven years, most of the provinces act semi-autonomously from the central government; for example, Shaba province issues its own currency. In the following report, we document some of the most important features of this genocidal looting operation. On Sept. 21, 1996, a tiny Toronto, Canada-based raw materials company, Banro Resources Corp., obtained the concession to mine gold in Zaire's central-east province of Kivu. The rich concession starts in the town of Bukavu, and extends southward. Bukavu was the site of one of the major Rwandan refugee camps in Zaire, which was teeming with half-starved women and children. Banro needed this site cleared of people to begin its mining operations; the clearing started with Uganda's invasion of Zaire in mid-October. Banro appears to be a cutout for the Anglo American Corporation, which is the world's biggest mining company, and a key cog in the international oligarchy's Club of the Isles raw materials cartel. In August 1996, Toronto-based Barrick Gold obtained a gold mining concession in Zaire's northeast province, Haut Zaire, which reportedly covers 83,000 square kilometers. The Hollinger Corp.-allied Barrick is chaired by Peter Munk, and its strategy is shaped by the international intelligence network of former U.S. President George Bush, who is honorary senior adviser to its international advisory board. Also during 1996, the tiny Vancouver-based raw materials company Consolidated Eurocan, headed by international wheeler-dealer Adolf Lundin, began work on exploiting the Tenke-Fungurume copper-cobalt mines in Zaire's southernmost Shaba province, near the border with Zambia, which has the richest cobalt reserves in the world. Cobalt is a strategic metal, crucial in forming alloys with steel and other metals, giving them great strength and heat resistance. Some 40% of cobalt's use is in aircraft gas turbine engines, and 10% is in magnetic alloys. Consolidated Eurocan is purchasing the mining property in phases, for a quarter of a billion dollars, which is a ``song,'' for a property that could yield many tens of billions of dollars in revenues. Consolidated Eurocan is in a joint venture in this deal with Anglo American. Simultaneously, over the past 18 months, the American-based, Canadian-run American Mineral Fields, of former DeBeers Diamond executive Jean-Raymond Boulle, has obtained the Kipushi zinc mines in Shaba province, one of the largest sources of zinc in the world; the Vancouver- and Cayman Islands-based Panorama International has obtained significant cobalt holdings in Shaba province; and, Zaire's diamond company, MIBA (Zaire is one of the three largest diamond producers in the world), has been thrown open to bidding and takeover by foreign firms. - The `Second Great Scramble' -
When Maj. Gen. Paul Kagame, the Rwandan defense minister, recently called for a new Berlin Conference to set new borders for African states--referring to the 1884-85 Berlin Conference of the imperialist powers which ratified the national borders that are now in effect in Africa--he had in mind the fragmentation of Zaire into mini-states as a paradigm for all of Africa. The first Berlin Conference occurred during what was called the ``Great Scramble,'' during the 1880s and 1890s. Imperialist Britain and France led the way, and were joined by Belgium, Italy, and Germany, in grabbing up the raw material wealth of Africa. The Berlin Conference codified the Congo, which included present-day Zaire, as the personal property of Belgium's King Leopold II. Leopold II worked the Congo like a plantation, with brutal methods. For example, Congolese Africans who did not meet their production quotas had their arms amputated. This time around, the British are making a move to push the Belgians and French entirely out of Central Africa, and, at the same time, they don't want to have the expense of running a nation-state, an institution that they don't like anyway. Rather, they deploy the companies of their global raw materials cartel to buy up sections of a country. They keep the people needed to run the mining and related enterprises alive at subsistence levels, and the rest of the population is treated as useless eaters, left to starve or be butchered. Driving the British actions this time, is another ``Great Scramble.'' The international financier oligarchy, grouped around the House of Windsor, knows that the world financial bubble--which they themselves created--cannot be sustained, and will burst. They are getting out of paper financial instruments and into hard commodities: precious metals, such as gold; strategic metals, such as cobalt and tantalum; base metals, such as copper and zinc; energy supplies; and increasingly scarce food supplies. They want to either own the physical assets, or, better still, own the mine production facility for these assets. As the price of the hard commodity asset goes up, the oligarchy makes super-profits. At the same time, they have finger-tip control over the minerals, food stuffs, and so on upon which human life depends. They plan to exercise a food- and raw materials-control dictatorship in a post-collapse world. The international oligarchy already owns extensive raw materials holdings. But they now seek to obtain those holdings in Africa, Ibero-America, and Asia, which they don't control. Mineral-rich Zaire is in their target sights. Zaire's mineral belt is located in the eastern and southern part of the country (see {{Figure 1}}). It is a crystalline belt that runs alongside the Great Rift, a geological fault running from the Jordan River Valley in the Middle East, south through the Gulf of Aqaba, through Central Africa (where Zaire is located), down to southern Africa. - IMF, World Bank, financiers cut off credit -
Most of Zaire's raw materials holdings are owned by the state, and President Mobutu Sese Seko has resisted selling them to foreigners. A seven-year campaign, including a total credit and aid cutoff of Zaire, has been waged to force Mobutu to give in. At the center of the campaign has been the International Monetary Fund (IMF), the World Bank, and the international banks, which are run by the same oligarchical forces that run the global raw materials cartel. On June 29, 1960, Zaire obtained its independence from Belgium, although, as with many African countries, it was only a partial independence, because the countries were kept in economic backwardness. In the case of Zaire, in 1961, its first elected President, Patrice Lumumba, was assassinated. Mobutu, who had been an Army general, was made President in 1965. In 1967, he declared that all the minerals in Zaire's subsoil belonged to Zaire, and nationalized the foreign mining holdings, which meant principally Belgium's two all-powerful companies, Union Miniere and Societe Generale. According to one source, ``The Belgians were so angry at Zaire that they took with them all their records and plans needed to mine.'' Despite difficulties, and while never enjoying true economic developments that would have brought a decent standard of living to Zaire's now 40 million people, Zaire nonetheless was able to harness and mine some of its immense raw materials wealth. A sample of what Zaire accomplished can be gleaned from the report of the {Minerals Yearbook}, published by the Bureau of the Mines of the U.S. Department of Interior (Vol. III). In 1988, among the world's raw materials mining countries, Zaire held the following rank, for the following commodities: Cobalt -- world's largest producer and exporter Diamonds -- 2nd in the world Copper -- 5th in the world Tin -- 12th in the world Zinc -- 20th in the world Zaire also mined other commodities, such as barite, boron, magnesium, and gold. Because of historical ties, Zaire shipped a good amount of these goods to Belgium. In the 1960s, in order to run its mining operations, Zaire created the state-owned La Generale des Carrieres et des Mines du Zaire, which is known by its acronym, Gecamines. One of its other important state-owned companies was based in Kivu province, the Societe Miniere et Industrielle de Kivu, known by its acronym Sominki. When Belgium granted Zaire independence, it bequeathed to Zaire about $5 billion in debt, which Belgium had run up. By the late 1980s, Zaire's debt stood at about $8 billion--a large debt for a small economy based on raw materials and food, but no manufacturing. Zaire got further and further behind on its debt payments, and finally defaulted on most of it in the early 1990s. This was the excuse that the banks wanted. They demanded that Zaire pay the debt, but also, joined by the World Bank and others, demanded that Zaire ``democratize'' its government and, especially, privatize its state-owned raw materials mining concerns. Privatization had three components: slashing the social services provided to miners by law, laying off half the workforce at Gecamines, and selling more than half of the different properties of Gecamines and Sominki to foreign investors. Secessionist movements were started in Shaba province; the net effect would be to dismantle the Zairean state. The banks organized an international credit cutoff, meaning that Zaire could not get the money to purchase mining machinery, spare parts, and other essential imports. The West had always denied Zaire technology transfer, as long as the raw materials wealth was primarily in Zairean hands. Around 1993, the World Bank and IMF declared a credit cutoff to Zaire. A senior source at the U.S. Geological Survey reported on Nov. 27, 1996, that the World Bank and its loan guarantee agency, the Multi-Lateral Investment Guarantee Corporation (MIGA), recommended to Zaire that it would not get new money until it agreed to ``modernize,'' that is, privatize, its mining operations, by selling off sections of state holdings. At about the same time, the governments of Belgium, France, and the United States cut off all official government aid to Zaire. Currency warfare was unleashed in 1990, and has continued to this day. At one point, the Zairean currency, the zaire, depreciated from a few new zaires to the dollar, to 3,250 to the dollar. This devaluation meant that Zaire earned almost nothing for its foreign exports. As the U.S. Geological Survey source explained, ``The economy went down the tubes. Mining production today is 10% of what it was in the late 1980s. Because of the economic dislocation, most of the provinces are operating on their own.'' Indeed, between 1987 and 1993, cobalt production fell 82%, and copper production fell 90%. As a result, exports of minerals and metals, which accounted for three-quarters of Zaire's foreign exchange earnings, dried up. Zaire's ability to service the debt, should it choose to do so, disappeared. The conditions of life for the population worsened, in a country in which living conditions were already bad. In 1990, only 39% of Zaireans had access to safe drinking water. Infrastructure is virtually nonexistent. In 1994, Zaire's infant mortality rate was 111 deaths per 1,000 live births, i.e., an 11% infant death rate, more than 13 times that in the United States. In 1992, the last year for which figures were available, 335,000 Zairean children under the age of five died. In 1994, life expectancy in Zaire was 53 years, lower than in 1990. Under this assault, President Mobutu opened the door to privatizing Zaire's patrimony, although still not at a rate fast enough to satisfy the World Bank vultures. - The corporate invasion - At the heart of the invasion of Zaire's mining properties, are the Canadian mining companies and the Oppenheimer family-run Anglo American Corp., which often takes the Canadian companies under its wing in joint ventures. The Canadian mining companies started an invasion of Zaire in 1994, which reached a flood tide in 1996. This was the opening shot of the ``Second Great Scramble.'' The Canadian mining companies represent forward beachheads for the Commonwealth-centered British Empire (see {EIR Special Report,} May 24, 1996, ``The Sun Never Sets on the New British Empire''). Behind the companies, lurks the shadowy presence of the Oppenheimer family's Anglo American Corp., the linchpin of the Club of the Isles' raw materials cartelization strategy. We look at three examples. First, the takeover of Sominki, in Kivu province, by Toronto-based Banro Resource Corp. Zaire has three eastern provinces: Haut Zaire, in the northeast; Kivu, in the center-east; and Shaba (formerly Katanga), in the southeast. Kivu province is second in richness of raw materials, after Shaba. The leading mining concern in Kivu is the Societe Miniere et Industrielle de Kivu, or Sominki. Sominki was formed in 1976 as an amalgamation of nine companies that had been operating in Kivu province since the early 1900s. It operates 47 mining concessions, encompassing an area of 10,271 square kilometers. In 1996, Banro Corp. of Toronto bought 36% of Sominki, raising some of its money for the purchase by floating shares in Singapore. Banro was previously a small financial institution, with little apparent aptitude for mining. The impression is that it was reconfigured as a company for the special purpose of this purchase, perhaps acting as a front for someone. (Who that someone is, will become clear.) Another large chunk of Sominki was bought by the Belgium-based company Mines D'or du Zaire, or MDDZ. Owning 60% of MDDZ is Cluff Mining Co. of London, and controlling 65% of Cluff is Anglo American Corp., the world's largest mining company and a key component of the Club of the Isles. On Sept. 21, 1996, Banro and MDDZ announced their merger, with Banro selling its shares to MDDZ. The new Banro-MDDZ company consolidated a 72% stake in Sominki, while the government of Zaire holds 28%. The Banro-MDDZ entity has announced that it plans to acquire that 28% from the government. The overall enterprise is essentially a vehicle for Anglo American. According to various Banro corporate reports and news releases, Banro was anxious to get its mining operations started as quickly as possible. However, the Sominki mining zone that Banro acquired started in the town of Bukavu, the center for the major camp for Rwandan refugees who had fled to Zaire, with nearly a million people. To get mining started, the entire zone would require clearing. Suddenly, as Uganda launched its invasion of eastern Zaire, near Bukavu, in mid-October, there was firing on the Bukavu refugee camp, supposedly against ``Hutu rebels'' who were hiding there. The military attack on the camp forced hundreds of thousands of refugees to flee Kivu province, back to Rwanda. But, who did the firing? While a clear answer is not forthcoming, it may have involved portions of the newly acquired Sominki apparatus itself. For, in acquiring Sominki, Banro did not just acquire a company; it acquired the effective governmental structure of the entire Kivu province. According to a Banro corporate press release, ``Sominki owns an extensive infrastructure which includes repair shops, machine shops, electrical shops and a large fleet of Land Rover vehicles. In addition, it operates six hydroelectric sites, a number of air strips, and 1,000 kilometers of roads. Sominki is virtually self-sufficient. The company has about 5,000 employees.'' The release added, ``In fact, Sominki is {the de facto government providing all the essential services for the Kivu Province}'' (emphasis added). Banro/Anglo American effectively stole a good chunk of the government of Kivu. This is the British model for the Second Great Scramble. As a mining company, Sominki has its own explosives supplies and access to weapons, i.e., it has the capability to carry out such an attack, or is in a commanding position to influence, those who fired on the refugee camps. The second example, is that of American Mineral Fields (AMF), which is based in Hope, Arkansas, but run from Canada. AMF has acquired from Gecamines the Kipushi copper-zinc mine, one of the world's premier copper-zinc mines, located in Shaba province (copper and zinc are often mined together). The Belgians developed Kipushi and began mining in 1925. At its peak in 1988, the Kipushi mine produced 143,000 tons of zinc, and 43,000 tons of copper. Its total known and probable reserves stand at 22.6 million tons, grading 2.1% copper and 13.8% zinc. AMF is the brainchild of its owner, Jean-Raymond Boulle, a former executive for DeBeer's Diamonds. In turn, AMF signed an agreement with Anglo American, which allows Anglo American to invest up to $100 million in any AMF venture in Shaba province, representing up to a 50% equity stake in the venture, including the Kipushi mine. Once again, ubiquitous Anglo American shows up. The third example, is that of tiny Consolidated Eurocan of Vancouver. In 1996, Eurocan finalized a deal that will allow it to purchase from the state mining company Gecamines, a 55% interest in the Tenke-Fungurume copper-cobalt deposits. Eurocan will pay a quarter of a billion dollars over 72 months for its stake, but the stake is worth potentially tens of billions of dollars in revenues. According to a Eurocan spokesman on Dec. 18, Tenke-Fungurume, located in Shaba province, represents the largest operating cobalt reserves in the world. It has geological reserves of 222 million tons of copper and cobalt, with potential reserves of 1 billion tons. Consolidated Eurocan is owned and run by Canadian wheeler-dealer Adolf Lundin. One U.S. mining source reported, ``There is no way that Eurocan can develop the mines on its own. It doesn't have the capabilities. It will have to sell off shares to established mining companies, most likely Iskor and Gencor, to work the properties.'' Iskor and Gencor are both South African companies, and part of the British raw materials cartel. Thus, these Canadian companies, in some cases stalking horses for Anglo American, are gobbling up Zaire's gold, copper, zinc, and cobalt reserves. Add to this, the Barrick Gold purchase of a huge concession in Haut Zaire, and the fact that there is now discussion of opening up the major government-owned diamond mining company, Societe Miniere de Bakwanga (MIBA), to foreign investors. MIBA accounts for 40% of Zaire's official diamond exports. The remaining 60% are developed by artisanal miners, i.e., prospectors, who then sell the gems to ``Israeli diamond buyers and to [international gem dealer] Maurice Templesman,'' according to a knowledgeable source. The Belgian-born Tempelsman, who squired around Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis before she died, is an international tycoon. He is former president of the U.S. Africa Society, a group that is influential in the shaping of U.S. government Africa policy.
To hell with illegitimate president Mugabe! SADC ought to remind him sternly that he has not been elected by Zimbos and that unless he settles down on a real 50/50 share in government, new elections under UN supervision should become the order of the day.
In case devil Mugabe continues to confiscate power, concerted action by SADC should aim at dislodging him even if it comes to using armed forces of the neighbouring countries.
Who is devil Mugabe to impose his will on how the 50/50 compromise should be enacted? Why SADC does not defy him since he is not recognized as the legitimate leader?
It seems that under the faltering position of SADC, Zimbabwe will continue to be the rotten banana republic of the dictator, monster, murderer Mugabe.
History has already condemned him.
The only hope for Zimbabwe is for the Police and Army foot soldiers to realize how stupid they are to support Zanu PF
Brother Prem, SADC is useless. We thought that the coming to power of Zuma (in the form of Motlante) was going to reenergise SADC but it seems these liberation war heroes have a way of reaching out to each other. It can be Mbeki vs Zuma but you will find that when it comes to Mugabe the two adversaries bury the knives and stand together to support a long time comrade. All that we did not know and presupposed has been exhumed and revealed to us: that Mugabe has the support of all these SADC rulers except Ian Khama of Botswana. With the death of Levy Mwanawasa in Zambia, I bet my last dollar that Rupiah Banda now supports Mugabe. The multi billion US$ question is why does most of these simingly good leaders support a dictator who has been in power for close to three decades? I would understand Edwardo Dos Santos of Angola's support for Mugabe but I would not understand why Jacob Zuma, Kgalema Motlante, Jakaya Kikwete, Bingu waMutharika, Amando Guebbuzza etc support Mugabe with a passion. SADC leaders like Kikwete support democracy during the night to get aid from the West but during the day they are not ashamed to support dictators like Mugabe. Perhaps the SADC leaders want leaders to change but they do not want the political party in power to change as is the case in Zimbabwe at the present moment. But that is unfair because in Zimbabwe, ZANU (PF) used to have very good younger leaders who could take over from Mugabe but Mugabe would not even allow internal succession. People like Tsvangirai who had never dreamt of being presidents before 1997 had to move in to fill in the yawning political vacuum as the young ZANU (PF)leaders took turns to refuse to go into the ring against their charismatic leader. Other like Mavambo leader, Simba Makoni were actually driven into opposition politics by the wicked desire to split the opposition vote so that Tsvangirai does not win against their Dear Leader, Mugabe. So given the scenario, I have highlighted who can blame Tsvangirai for filling in the void left by the young ZANU (PF)generation? To complicate issues for ZANU (PF), its young generatin has all been tainted by Mugabe's corrupt rule that it will be impossible for Zimbabweans to vote for another ZANU (PF) leader after Mugabe. It's clear that after Mugabe leaves power (through death), an opposition leader will rise to power in Zimbabwe.
Since none of us have a heaven or hell to put anyone, I think we should express ourselves without name calling.If the leaders donot want to share the power 50/50,then I perfer President Mugabe 150% to finish out his term as the Great Hero and Leader of Zimbabwe and Its' Peoples.Never again should we be governed by other Nations unfairly.God will surely make a way for us if we just lean on him and call his name,Jesus!Jesus! he will hear us.God Bless Africa and America.Oweij Liebo- Tarboro,North Carolina USA.
gabe has tarnished his name forever it and it will not be know as a great hero or liberator outside a few southern African countries but he will be remembered as a murderer, dictator and a power hungry currupt president who will soon be forgotten...So you live in a nation and prosper of the white anglo peoples so be careful of who you accuse of unfairly governing. Never use Jesus will make a way if we lean on Him and not Mugabe or the Zanu-pf. Which one is your God? mugabe or Jesus????
You've been governed by Mugabe for hte last 28 years, and now look at the state of the country. Its a disgrace. Why would you want anymore of this?
Leviboone, what a hypocrite you are. On one hand you regard a satan, murderer, oppressor and a selfish thieving tyrant, Mugabe, "the "great hero and leader of Zimbabwe" and at the same time you invoke the name of Jesus. If you believe in Christ you should know that to torture, burn people alive, murder them and create hunger and strife is wrong and against His teachings. To oppress is wrong. To steal is wrong. It is a known fact Mugabe has killed thousands of Zimbabweans and his hands continue to drip with the blood of his own brothers and sisters. That is a hero? YOUR hero? You are a confused person. Christ forgives wrong doings but does not condone the sadistic actions of the likes of unrepentant Mugabe. Christ is God and He is outraged.
BaBoone we have already established your idiocy in these esteemed pages. Mind your own damned business and stay out of Zimbabwean matters. Your commentary is childish , immature , speaks of your intelligence level. Go interfere somewhere else , you are unwelcome here ! Hapana basa !
Yes indeed Leviboone, worship Jesus and worship Mugabe at the same time - how confused can a person be? Everything Mugabe is doing to the people of Zimbabwe is an outrage and totally against the teachings of Christ. Get your heroes straight or is Jesus just someone you mention in passing.
Quite obviously common sense did not prevail. Tsvangirai quite rightly rejected the unequitable and impractical suggestion that there be two Ministers of Home Affairs - now sadly there is no obvious way forward unless the AU / UN decide that they need to step into the breach in order to make good SADC's repeated failings.
In the meantime there is no GNU, therefore Mugabe will form his own government and now concentrate on overturning the MDC's control of the House of Assembly. Don't be surprised if a State of Emergency is declared and Parliament is suspended. All the while the 2008/09 agricultural season is most likely going to be the worst on record.
Katz, I agree with you that the way forward is international surpervised elections. SADC's failure to see things differently than just backing Mugabe, is disappointing. This was a moment for SADC to change things in Zimbabwe and the opportunity has been lost. You correctly point out that the next move from the Mugabe regime will be state of emergency and violence against the opposition.
An African soultion to an African problem, I am sure none of you are overly surprised, dissapointed yes but surprised not really. The writing has been on the wall. Even the hope that SA might take a serious stance was dashed. It must have been obvious when Botswana and Zambia were not there, they must ahve known the decision by SADC majority and decided not to lend their name to it. An Africa Solution to an African problem, well may be it is time that SADC countries should now give the finance and aid to Mugabe. The West should shun this farce and let these so called leaders put their money where their mouth is. They will soon sing a different tune when it comes from their pockets.
The SADC has decided to support Mugabe outside of Zambia and Botswana so I agree West withold your money from the SADC and see how long they continue to support Mugabe. When it affexts their pockets I promise you they will change their words...I live here in Africa and I am so frustrated that when the money donated by the West which is a huge amount rarely helps the people it is sent to help. It goes no futher than the pockets of the corrupt leadership. Another thing Africa wants our money always they will never turn that down. I agree the Western governments are far from perfect but they do have a far better working government than any African country. There are rules in place when corrupt leaders are found out they are gone from office and placed in prison...So as much as you want to hate the West a huge part is you are just jealous of the West.
Afric35, This is exactly the kind of attitude that we as Africans should fight against - being dictated to. It only goes to show how far we still are from being totally free to determine our affairs. We may have achieved political independence but we are still a long way from achieving economic independence. If we adopt racist Afric35's attitude then we remain beggers in perpetuity. There is therefore need for mental liberation before we can talk of economic liberation. As long as we believe that the West is our saviour and should "donate" money to us then we are doomed.
In the first place there is nothing called free money from the West. One way or the other they get that money back, ten fold. The West are in business to make money for their countries and citizens and hence there is nothing like them "donating" money to us. This is just the same wealth that left Africa via the ship and is now coming back throgh Western banks. One thing that Africans need realise is that the West needs us more than we need them. They do not have resources and these are found in abundance in Africa. The one and only problem we have as Africans is that we do not want to recognise what we have and use that power to determine our own destiny.
Today the West talk boostfully about having money to splash around, but if I may ask, where did they get this money from? America used slave labour, African labour, for five hundred years to be where she is today. Europe used slave labour, African labour, for five hundred years, to be where she is today.
They talk of having "...far better working government than any African country..." but is this not because of the wealth and the riches they stole from Africa? Had they been poor, like what they made Africa to be, would their govts be that stable? I doubt it because before colonising us, Europeans were fighting war after war for scarce resources.
Afric35 has the audacity to insult Africans when he said that "...Another thing Africa wants our money always they will never turn that down...". Are you sure Africa wants your filthy lucre? A big NO, Africa needs her wealth from the West. In his foolish mind he thinks Africans can just be dictated to simply because they do not have control of their resources. He fails to put a distiguition between sell outs like Tsvangirai, who worship the whiteman, and revolutionaries like President Mugabe who has set out to totally liberate their people from the york of slavery. That is why Afric35 can actual further insult us saying "...West withold your money from the SADC...".
As Africans we need to stand up and clearly and loudly say, enough is enough - we can no longer allow ourselves to be continually exploited and dictated to like this. Why don't we withhold our resources, take over all Western companies that are syphoning our wealth our of Africa and see if they can have the guts to say what Afric35 is vomitting. You need to read Thuthu's detailed post on the exploitation of mineral wealth in DRCongo in order to realise the extend to which the West is exploiting us, fifty years (for some African countires) after liberating ourselves from colonial bondage. We need to stand up and be counted, no body will ring the bell for us to take back our wealth.
There is no other way out of the predicament that Africa finds itself than to liberate our resources from foreign ownership. Imperialists should be sent packing so that we see who needs who in their so-called globalised world. I can bet with my head that they will come to us on their knees, begging for forgiveness. It is Africa's turn now to dictate things in the world - its now or never will it ever happen.
All African govts should start empowering their indigenous citizens so that exploitation stops forthwith. Zimbabwe, through President Mugabe, is leading the way. We now have our land back and a law is in place to ensure that, initially, indigenous Africans acquire 51% ownership of all foreign owned companies and with time this should increase to 100%. STAND UP AND BE COUNTED YOU SON OF THE SOIL.
Takunya, what you dont realise, is that without donations from the west, there would be countless Zimbabweans starving on a daily basis. Look how much aid is required to prop up the country.
And you make me laugh, the west doesnt need Africa. What a joke. You talk about slave labour like it was yesterday. Stop living in the past, and get with today.
I'm glad to see that you admit that all european countries have "far better working government than any African country..." and there is one reason for it. Corruption. The first thing required to get a government working is to remove corruption. Zimbabwe is the 14th most corrupt country in the world. Go figure! And thats something that you simply cant blame on anyone but Mugabe.
" revolutionaries like President Mugabe who has set out to totally liberate their people from the york of slavery."
I'm sorry... when was slavery aboloshed? I think you have your centuries mixed up. Just goes to show the lack of education behind your silly rants!
Awt_independent, I am happy you concur that the Western world was built on slave labour and continue to prosper on the exploitation of Africa, its resources and its labour. It is this unfair distribution of resources espicially in our Africa that we will not tolerate and leave to continue another decade. We are going to fight you Awt until you leave our continent and stop syphoning our resources to your western countries.
You say Zimbabwe is 14th most corrupt country? You are wrong. Which country is number one most corrupt in the world? Obviously it is America and Europe which brought misery to the whole financial world when Wall Street crumbled. McCain said as much during campaigns when he said "...I am going to fight corrupt at Wall Street...when I become president..." What corruption was your Senator talking about if corruption only exist in Africa? May Wall Street is now in Africa.
Slavery, as practised in America and in Africa before independence, might have been abolished (on paper) a long time ago but the practice did not stop immediately. In Africa, and Zimbabwe in particular, we had to take up arms in order to erradicate slavery. Our war of liberation only started in 1890 and ended in 1980, why would we go to war if there was no slavery? And what is the difference between colonialism and slavery?
Is one not a slave when one is given money only to survive until tommorrow so that they can report again to work to labour for the master? To me that is the worst kind of slavery and, one that still exist in Africa today. It is the kind of slavery that we will fight as Africans until all slave masters leave our continent, and that includes you, Awt.
If you truly believe that by giving loans to Africa you are "donating" then please keep you money and we will keep our resources. Tell your west that WE DO NOT NEED THEIR "DONATIONS". We are not a donor dependent people, we have the energy and brains to work for ourselves and prosper without your "donations". By "donating" to us you are only slowing down our development.
Today we have stooges and sellouts like Tsvangirai who worship the west to get "donations". He even had the guts to tell Zimbabweans that "...I have friends in the west ready to pour in 10 billion dollars ...". What bullshit. That dependence syndrome has totally damaged his brain and now he can no longer think for himself. For everything he needs to first of all swing with imperialists to be able to make a decision.
We are equal partners in this world and hence our lives should not dependent on the good will of some western donor in Europe or America. It is Africa's way or the highway.
Takunya,
Once again you twist my words. Either that your your english still requires alot of work. I never mentioned that "the Western world was built on slave labour and continue to prosper on the exploitation of Africa, its resources and its labour." because its simply not true.
As for "We are going to fight you Awt until you leave our continent and stop syphoning our resources to your western countries." 1) I'm not in africa. 2) I'm not syphoning any resources.
And yes, Zimbabwe is the 14th most corrupt country. What happened in Wall Street was all within the realms of the law.
Blatant theft of money from the government coffers to fund the government's lavish lifestyle is just that, theft. No wonder there is not enough money left to fund a government. How much money does Mugabe have hidden away? There are estimates of over $400m USD. And meanwhile is country suffers, people starve and people like you support this greed.
As for slavery, if you really think you were still fighting slavery in 1980, then you need to read a dictionary and see what Slavery actually is. The slave trade was abolished centuries ago, but idiots like you still try and use it as an excuse for racial divide.
And I think you should tell all the starving MDC supporters that the west should keep their donations of food and see what they say. They are the majority of the country afterall. You are joke if you seriously believe that Zimbabwe is not a donor dependent country. Millions are fed in Zimbabwe on aid. You need to get out to the countryside and see for yourself the mess that your illustrious Mugabe has created. Zimbabwe would be a humanitarian disaster if it wasnt for the help of the west.
And the west does indeed have 10 billion dollars ready to help the people of Zimbabwe. Its only idiots like you and the feeble Mugarbage that stand its way. And the people of Zim will get what they want. It always happens. Whether its now, or in 10 years time, Mugabe will be gone, and the people of Zimbabwe will be able to live freely again.
If you seriously think that Zimbabwe can feed itself, you are a joke. Actually, we've already figured that part out.
There are many fools that reply to thse posts but soe should be banned for supporting Zanu-pf b/c of their true ignorance. If I worked in the Zanu-pf I would have fired you long ago but apparentley they are as foolish as you are otherwise they would not have hired you......Enforcing your beliefs on a country is not political independence it is called dictatorship in what Mugabe and the Zanu-pf has done. SADC is just a buch of corrupt leaders who will not stand up too Mugabe b/c they fear he will tell all of their dirty little secrets.
If I were racist as you claim I definately would not be living in Africa so please stop with your pitiful excuses trying to prove me wrong. With every word you type your ignorance becomes much easier to see.
Robbing Africa well there has to be something to rob and sorry the West has not robbed Africa of nothing. The slavery days ended long ago so shut up about something that has been abolished many years ago and well you need to get rid of your racist attitude.
Oh yes you stole land that belonged to the white farmers so you will twist words and reports to make it okay for Mugabe and the Zanu-pf to do that, so shut up about Mugabe being some kind of here most countries in the world will not even allow him to step foot in their country not any hero I know of. He knows as well as you that he and many of the zanu-pf face crimes against humanity charges and prison once they are removed from power. Mugabe and the zanu-pf have helped the people how??????? Nada only the so called anglo white is the one truly helping the starving Zimbabweans as we speak. Mugabe and the Zanu-pf could care less who suffers as long as they prosper...
I did not sleep last night celebrating our victory over evil. Common sense prevailed at the SADC Summit in SA. Our leaders managed to see Tsvangirai and his western imperialist handlers for what they are - snakes trying to enter their house. There was no other decision that was to come out of this summit except to declare that the govt should be formed forthwith. This was a bold statement which reverberated not only in the region but the world over to say there is no room in Southern Africa for Tsvangirai to swing with McGee and sell our heritage.
This loud and clear message should not only dawn on Tsvangirai but also on Khama who thought he could get SADC's support in destabilising Zimbabwe through the use of militias like is happening in DRCongo where Nkunda with support from Kagame is massacring innocent Congolese in North Kivu Province.
The ball is now in Tsvangirai's court and it is him and him alone who has to make the next move either to go along with what SADC is saying or to stick to the plan given to him by McGee of intending to take the issue of Zimbabwe to the UNSC. But MDC needs to be reminded that Tsvangirai's neighbours and peers are those who spoke with one voice yesterday in Johannesburg - form the govt immediately without any further delay. These are the people he is going to interact with most when he becomes PM and not McGee.
Without SADC support, even if the case of Zimbabwe is taken to the UNSC as per America and Britain's ultimate plan, it will be shot down by progressive members of the UNSC. Mind you USA, UK and EU are not the world neither are they the international community, as they are fond of calling themselves, but are just part of it. They can no longer unilaterally take a decision against another member state like they did in Iraq and get away with it. The Republican Party was severely defeated at the polls recently precisely because of unilateralism. Any such decision on the part of imperialists is going to be suicidal and I am sure Obama realises that very well.
Tsvangirai should be reminded that he did not win the March 29 elections and chickened out of the June 27 run-off. He can therefore never be an equal partner in the inclusive govt. He is being invited into this govt so that we can work together as Zimbabweans. Only after he is in the unity govt will he realise that Zanu pf is an honest party and is lead by mature revolutionaries who have never dreamt of wanting to destroy him and/or his western created MDC.
Zanu pf is aware that the people who are blindly supporting Tsvangirai are doing so out of egnorance of what MDC really stands for. Zanu pf is well aware that when 47% Zimbabweans voted for Tsvangirai on March 29 they did so with their stomachs (the suffering they are going through which is being caused by the sanctions that Tsvangirai himself called for) and not their conscience that is why they later rejected him on 27 June.
Therefore, if the deal goes through, as it should unless Tsvangirai insists on swinging with McGee, all Zimbabweans will realise that Zanu pf meant well for them from the very beginning. The intentions of the revolutionary party is to make them fully independent of any form of outside dictation and empower them 100% and that they should never again beg anyone for anything, especially imperialists.
Please ignore Takunya's post. He is paid by the ZANU PF's Ministry of Information (propaganda department) to post as much propganda on the web as possible. If you read any of his posts you'll see that he makes things up, has no evidence to support any of his claims, lies blantanly and will call any person who is against the tyranny of Mugabe everyname under the sun in an attempt to discredit them. So please dont waste your time with Takunya, he's a classic example of why you should never argue with an idiot. He'll only bring you down to his level and beat you with experience.
Yet again we see SADC leaders beat around the bush and afraid to come out in the open and let all to know that it is Mugabe who is holding back the whole process of a unity government by his continued hunger for power. Well, all I can say is that Mr Tsvangirai must keep up the courage not to accept any half ass offerings because even if he did, he would be doing Zimbabwe a great disservice as it would make absolutely NO difference to Zimbabwe as Mugabe would remain the head honcho. Ministries cannot be shared. They are not food or property. They are the lives of the people and so far Mugabe has clearly proved that all he is good for is stealing and all he is wanting is continued control and power to crap over those people and now to ride on Mr Tsvangirai's coat tail. Hold tight Mr Tsvangirai, giving in to a mickey mouse form of government will do nothing to protect and serve your people and country, so why do it.
Please ignore Takunya's post. He is paid by the ZANU PF's Ministry of Information (propaganda department) to post as much propganda on the web as possible. If you read any of his posts you'll see that he makes things up. His claim that Tsvangirai has called for sanctions against the people of Zimababwe is false and designed to alienate Tsvangirai from the people of Zimbabwe. He has no evidence of this, and if he tries to tell you that it was on BBC Hard Talk, look up the episode on youtube, and you will find that there is no talk of sanctions from Tsvangirai at all. He also is unable to name a single sanction that sits against the people of Zimbabwe and has no evidence to support any of his claims, lies blantanly and will call any person who is against the tyranny of Mugabe everyname under the sun in an attempt to discredit them. So please dont waste your time with Takunya, he's a classic example of why you should never argue with an idiot. He'll only bring you down to his level and beat you with experience.
takunya_ndebvu, please shut up already.
No one is buying what you're selling.
You have no victory and all this means, is that Mugabe will be dragging Zimbabwe deeper into the abyss.
You are like a begger on here, but there is no one to give you satisfaction.
Do you have any idea what will happen to you once Mugabe is gone ??? He won't live forever, and then you will be very vulnerable.
You really need to study history.
You see, people like you have existed many times over, as propoganda machines for dictators.
What you need to seriously consider, is what happened to these people once the dictator was gone, because this is the fate that awaits you.
Study what happened to the minions of Idi Amin and Mobutu.
I take a great deal of joy when I think about what the future holds for you.
Mancam_28, You say I will be "vulnerable", vulnerable from what? Is that supposed to be a threat or what? That is why you MDC people will never be given the Home Affairs Ministry. You have retributive agendas and it has just clearly come out. However, be that as it may, I Takunya, am my own liberator by direct confrontation. I do not need anyone to lean on.
I support President Mugabe because he is visionary leader and is a revolutionary who has the people of Zimbabwe at heart. He has sacrificed all the happiness he could have on this earth to free Zimbabwe and to empower Zimbabweans. He spend 11 years in racist Rhodesia's jail fighting for the freedom of all Zimbabweans. He spend 5 years in the bush fighting to free all Zimbabweans including Tsvangirai. He opened opportunities for all Zimbabweans to go to school so that they could be employable. He has liberated our land from white robbers who stole it in 1890. He is empowering the resettled farmers by mechanising their farming vetures.
Such a person as President Mugabe does not need to beg for my support, he gets it without saying a word. Such a person as President Mugabe has a legecy that will live forever. Such a person as President Mugabe does not die but falls and continues to live among other fallen revolutionaries. A revolutionary continues to live in the hearts and minds of other living revolutionaries as is the case with heroes like Samora Machiel, Kwame Nkrumah, Thomas Sankara, Martin Luther King just to mention a few. That is what will protect me and not a physical being guarding me from MDC thugs, NO. I am prepared to die for what I believe in but before I die I will defend myself vigorously.
Afterall, no one can say for sure who among all of us is going to die first and who dies last. Everybody has his time and that time is with GOD. Unless of course you have teamed up with the devil to assassinate the President, then you can tell me when you are going to do it. But please be careful you may be the first one to go before all of us and will not be able to implement your retributive agenda.
I do not believe in calling for sanctions against the people of Zimbabwe, so I will not support Tsvangirai a single second. I do not believe in selling out - abandoning the liberation struggle and teaming up with the Rhodesian Special Branch to stop the momentum of the liberation struggle by killing freedom fighters.
I do not believe in siding with and protecting imperialist interests just to get filthy lucre for short term gains. I do not believe in swinging with a representative of an imperialist country, moreso when the representative boosts openly about the effects that the sanctions, his country has imposed, have on the people of Zimbabwe.
Therefore, Mancam_28, be assured that even if you hold a gun to my head I will not support you and MDC, even in my dream. You are cruel and insensitive to the suffering of Zimbabweans who are starving because of lack of food, are dying of cholera because of lack clean drinking water, and cannot get drugs, all because of the sanctions that Tsvangirai called and campaigned for. I WILL NOT SUPPORT SUCH A PERSON AT ALL!!!
PLEASE IGNORE TAKUNYA_NDEBVU. HE IS PAID BY THE ZANU PF'S MINISTRY OF INFORMATION (PROPOGANDA DEPARTMENT) TO POST AS MUCH PROPOGANDA ON THE WEB AS POSSIBLE TO PROMOTE THE MURDEROUS AND THEIVING ROBERT MUGABE. IF YOU READ ANY OF HIS POSTS YOU'LL SEE THAT HE MAKES THINGS UP AND CONTINUALLY LIES FOR THIS AIM. HE HAS NO CREDIBILITY WHATSOEVER AND SHOULD NOT BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY. HE WILL CONTINUNALLY CLAIM THAT TSVANGIRAI HAS CALLED FOR SANCTIONS AGAINST THE PEOPLE OF ZIMBABWE. THIS CLAIM IS 100% FALSE AND DESIGNED TO ALIENATE TSVANGIRAI FROM THE MAJORTIY OF THE PEOPLE IN ZIMBABWE THAT SUPPORT HIM. HE HAS NO EVIDENCE OF THIS, AND WILL TRY TO TELL YOU THAT THIS HAPPENED ON BBC HARDTALK. IF YOU LOOK UP TSVANGIRAI'S INTERVIEW ON HARDTALK THROUGH YOUTUBE, YOU WILL SEE THERE ARE NO MENTION OF SANCTIONS AT ALL. IT IS SIMPLY A LIE, LIKE THE REST OF HIS POSTS. HE IS ALSO UNABLE TO NAME A SINGLE SANCTION THAT SITS AGAINST THE PEOPLE OF ZIMBABWE AND HAS NO EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT ANY OF HIS CLAIMS AND LIES BLATANTLY ON A CONSTANT BASIS. HE WILL ALSO CALL ANY PERSON WHO IS AGAINST THE TRYANNY AND GENOCIDAL REIGN OF MUGABE WHO ARGUES WITH HIM ANY NAME UNDER THE SUN IN AN ATTEMPT TO DISCREDIT THEM. SO PLEASE DONT WASTE YOUR TIME WITH TAKUNYA, HE IS A CLASSIC EXAMPLE OF WHY YOU SHOULD NEVER ARGUE WITH A (SELF PROFESSED!)IDIOT. HE'LL ONLY BRING YOU DOWN TO HIS LEVEL AND BEAT YOU WITH EXPERINCE.
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Author: mancam_28 takunya_ndebvu, again you show your ignorance.
No one is buying that you care about Zimbabweans, and no one is buying that there are any sanctions against ordinary Zimbabweans.
Under your pre-school logic, Mugabe was doing so well before "sanctions", and Zimbabwens were thriving with food, education and shelter. And then sanctions came along and destroyed everything.
You are a lying hipocrate who has absolutely nothing to do with liberating Zimbabweans.
In answer to your question, no, it is not a threat...it is a promise.
No body will be holding a gun to your head, asking you to support the MDC. You will not be given the option. You have already shown your true colours, and do not pretend to be your own man. You are a sheep waiting for slaughter.
You accomplish nothing here, except to reaffirm the committment of Zimbabweans to wipe out evil.
You are evil, and justice is near.
Mancam_28, What is the difference between a threat directed at Takunya and a promise to kill Takunya? There seem to be no diffence as far as I am concerned. You say that I will not be given the chance and yet you want everybody on this site to believe that no gun will be pointed at my head.
You go further to say that I am "...a sheep waiting for slaughter". I understand "slaughter" to mean the killing of a large number of people in a cruel or violent way. So where do you stand on this promise you have made to me? When do you intent to accomplish your mission of wiping out all those who do not agree with your selling out mission?
Well, it is clear for everybody to see that this is the kind of intolerance that Zanu pf is fighting against. Before MDC came onto the political scene, there was no violence. Today it does not matter whether it is election time or not, MDC thugs are all over killing people simply because they refuse to tow the MDC sellout line.
Be reminded though that the CIA and MI5 who are advising you tried to do it in Iraq and Afghanstan but have totally failed to wipe their opponents out. If they are sincere they should tell you that it is pratically impossible to wipe out a whole country, for it is the whole country that support President Mugabe today.
Your promise therefore, only worsens an already bad situation because, now that I know what your intentions are, I am going to stay ready for you. You will not kill me while I wait for you and your CIA friends to accomplish your mission while I do nothing about it. I will continue to defend the revolution so that you do not even get the chance to deploy your militias who are currently stationed in Botswana. The British and Americans have wasted their money training you to become a killing machine in Zimbabwe like they have done with Nkunda in DRCongo.
PLEASE IGNORE TAKUNYA_NDEBVU. HE IS PAID BY THE ZANU PF'S MINISTRY OF INFORMATION (PROPOGANDA DEPARTMENT) TO POST AS MUCH PROPOGANDA ON THE WEB AS POSSIBLE TO PROMOTE THE MURDEROUS AND THEIVING ROBERT MUGABE. IF YOU READ ANY OF HIS POSTS YOU'LL SEE THAT HE MAKES THINGS UP AND CONTINUALLY LIES FOR THIS AIM. HE HAS NO CREDIBILITY WHATSOEVER AND SHOULD NOT BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY. HE WILL CONTINUNALLY CLAIM THAT TSVANGIRAI HAS CALLED FOR SANCTIONS AGAINST THE PEOPLE OF ZIMBABWE. THIS CLAIM IS 100% FALSE AND DESIGNED TO ALIENATE TSVANGIRAI FROM THE MAJORTIY OF THE PEOPLE IN ZIMBABWE THAT SUPPORT HIM. HE HAS NO EVIDENCE OF THIS, AND WILL TRY TO TELL YOU THAT THIS HAPPENED ON BBC HARDTALK. IF YOU LOOK UP TSVANGIRAI'S INTERVIEW ON HARDTALK THROUGH YOUTUBE, YOU WILL SEE THERE ARE NO MENTION OF SANCTIONS AT ALL. IT IS SIMPLY A LIE, LIKE THE REST OF HIS POSTS. HE IS ALSO UNABLE TO NAME A SINGLE SANCTION THAT SITS AGAINST THE PEOPLE OF ZIMBABWE AND HAS NO EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT ANY OF HIS CLAIMS AND LIES BLATANTLY ON A CONSTANT BASIS. HE WILL ALSO CALL ANY PERSON WHO IS AGAINST THE TRYANNY AND GENOCIDAL REIGN OF MUGABE WHO ARGUES WITH HIM ANY NAME UNDER THE SUN IN AN ATTEMPT TO DISCREDIT THEM. SO PLEASE DONT WASTE YOUR TIME WITH TAKUNYA, HE IS A CLASSIC EXAMPLE OF WHY YOU SHOULD NEVER ARGUE WITH A (SELF PROFESSED!)IDIOT. HE'LL ONLY BRING YOU DOWN TO HIS LEVEL AND BEAT YOU WITH EXPERINCE.
Ignorant Takunya, No one needs to threaten you as you already have what is coming to you.
Be Free, You say no one needs to threaten me when Mancam_28 is actually threatening me right here. He has clearly said that he and his fellow thugs are going to slaughter all those who do not agree with their view point - of supporting sanctions to effect regime change. How can you support such an open threats that border on barbarism when you know that it is wrong from the stand point of freedom of speech and association. I should be free, just as your names says - be free to associate with who so ever I want. Am I supposed to be slaughtered for that?
Takunya, you'll get whats coming to you. Dont you worry about that.
Awt_independent, Awaiting the day I will come face to face with you as you attempt to "slaughter" me and see who will "slaughtered" who.
I'm not talking about me Takunya, I'm talking about karma and the devil. Both are coming your way. But dont bother praying, you're in way to deep to ever get out.
Awt_independent, You are part of the Devil's killing machine and so I will be waiting for you whenever you are going to come. As for Khama, well, he is a nonentity, that is why he has become another "Mr Boycott". It won't be long before we start dealing with him.
Takunya... I hope you're not a religious man... God will judge you in time. Everything you say on here is noted by Him. So keep talking and digging yourself into a deeper hell.
Awt_independent, I notice you are now appealiing to GOD to protect you but at the same time you do not want others to be accorded the same protection by the same GOD. Just now you were telling me that I should not start praying because my death is imminent and irreversable but you want the same GOD to help you kill me. You have called for the violent removal of President Mugabe and have advocated for the invasion of my country by USA and UK as they help Tsvangirai's militias, trained in Botswana. So where do you stand? Are you for violence or peaceful means of resovlving disputes? If you are for the latter then stop encouraging anarchy in my country and start encouraging Tsvangirai to join in the implementation of the deal he signed and that was recently endorsed by SADC.
Keep diggin Takunya, keep digging....
More lies...
I have never "called for the violent removal of President Mugabe" and I have never "advocated for the invasion of my country by USA and UK". You really are grasping at straws.
As for Tsvangirai's "militias, trained in Botswana." Wait for it... another lie!
Not once have I encouraged anarchy in your country. Anarchy is coming your way whether you like it or not, and whether I call for it or not. You tread on your people for so long, its only a matter of time before they rise up to defeat the oppressor. History tells us this, and Mugabe should know its on its way.
Personally I would prefer Mugabe to respect the will of the people and step down and hand over power to the rightfully deserving MDC, so the country can move forwards with hope.
Under Mugabe the nation will continue on its downward slope to violence. And with it it you will slide into your own hell. Looking forward to it my dear freind? PS no sympathy for you from me.
Awt_independent, Not expecting any sympathy from the devil which, from time immemorial, has fought against righteousness.
I am not the devil. The devil you shall meet in time. Keep digging Takunya, keep digging.
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Takunya Ndebvu is one of the few ZANU (PF) supporters that do not understand the gravity of the situation. Perhaps it may be because he is one of the secrete 'ones' that are being paid in forex. But Takunya should know that having Tsvangirai in government would also ensure that he continues to get the forex doing his secrete work. Having Tsvangirai in government will save all Zimbabweans including the ZANU (PF)supporters. It's like having rain which helps the evil and the good but ironically comes the good God. Without Tsvangirai Takunya will crumble together with Mugabe and ZANU (PF).
Taku is a brainwashed moron don't waste your time reading his articles.He thinks like he is still living in the 70s. Wake up and open your eyes Taku - kwayedza. Look around see what is happening around the world. Zanu(PF) rhetorics of labelling western countries as enemies is now irrelevant and outdated. Lets get things straight here,MDC and its supporters are not second class citizens of Zimbabwe. Zimbabwe is for all Zimbabweans regardless of one's political affiliation. To be in Zanu(PF) does not mean you are the first class citizen of Zimbabwe. All we want is fairness, justice and democracy in Zimbabwe.Lets get real, majority of Zimbabweans are suffering right now, you can't deny it. They are worse than those people in a country with a civil war. Zanu(PF) is not going to rule forever, but Zimbabwe will prevail. To hell with SADCC! Its a toothless bulldog.SADCC is not acting in the interest of the people of Zimbabwe, but that of Zanu(PF). We are going to solve our problems as Zimbabweans, if it means an uprising then that will be the only solution. For now we want peace and justice to every Zimbabwean.
Change! Yes we can!!!
Zimbabwe forever!
Once again we hear foolish comments of evil being defeated but Mugabe is the EVIL along with the Zanu-pf fools. The past 20 years they have been in control and what have they done other than literally destroy Zimbabwe. Your snake is Robert Mugabe and shut up about Tsvangirai being connected in anyway connected to the West. The SADC is a bunch of poor excuses for leaders to stand up for Africa when they only stand up against whatever is best for them. Stop being afraid of Mugabe and the Zanu-pf otherwise the people of Zim will continue to starve and leave the country. It is sad no one will stand up to Mugabe and the Zanu-pf b/c they know if they do Mugabe will tell everything he knows. Until we have leaders who truly care about the people of their countries then Africa will continue to depend on the outside world to survive.
Now that SADC has failed to salvage unity talks, fresh elections organized by the international community is the only hope. The government of national unity (GNU), was going to fail and cost a whole lot of money to maintain. Every ministry having at least 10 leaders, would have been a disaster!!
Tsvangirai, should pull his party out of GNU, and call for new elections. He clearly does not get any respect for having won the Presidential elections from the SADC leaders. Tsvangirai, has had his own problems in convincing SADC leaders that he has true concerns for Zimbabwe, and not serving foreign interests. This is unfortunate, especially that he won the only open and free elections in Zimbabwe.
The Southern Africa (SADC) club remains a liberation movement group. Despite progress in many SADC countries, Mugabe is shielded by liberation allies like Angola, Namibia, Mozambique and to an extent ANC of South Africa. Tsvangirai is up against this club. Zimbabweans have shown that they are ready for Tsvangirai, and do accept and trust him to bring economic salvation for the country.
Phiri and other sober minded people out there(Except Takunya)you know what baffles me most and at all time, is the clear demonstration of stupidity to the highest degree manifested by SADC leaders.This organisation is an eye sore to us decent Africans.I don't blame people like Takunya but the SADC leaders for their ineptitude displayed on matters that are straight forward.I suggest that MDC should just sit by and watch Zanu-pf run thier property(Zimbabwe)with the help of SADC and let give them one year to the maximum.
Phiri - these are very dangerous times for Zimbabwe.Morgan Tsvangirai is going to come under immense political pressure to go along with the SADC directive and form a GNU with Mugabe on the basis that Mugabe has proposed. He must not do that, as the certain outcome of that course of action will be the complete neutralisation of the MDC. When that happens all hope for the people of Zimbabwe will be lost.
Tsvangirai needs to hold out and let Mugabe hang on his own rope. This will mean that MDC will be oppressed all the more so and many supporters will lose heart. Eventually, however, the situation for Mugabe will become untenable and even the liberation gerontocracy of SADC will realise that properly supervised free and fair elections are the only alternative.
It is very disappointing on the part of SADC to come to this resolution. How do they justify this let alone Mugabe's legitimacy?
Easily, I'm afraid to say. The liberation geriatrics look at all the problems that Mugabe has with an uppity vibrant opposition and they don't want to encourage the same in their countries. They are protecting each other and putting their personal interests ahead of those of their citizens.
Propaganda? The west taught the rest... What would surprise me is if it turned out that all of you that commented and ganged up on Takunya were actually Africans. If Takunya happens to inflate the truth a bit, then he rightly does so, for it is only in reaction to the white man's propaganda (for he is undoubtedly white). You never fail to invoke the suffering of the masses...when it suits you. "Loss" is an African reality as life simply is a perpetual struggle against an omnipresent death for everyone in that continent.... We have lost, and lost, and lost, families, friends, livelihoods, dignity, humanity, at the hands of the west. Death has long been embraced in Africa just as the U.S. has embraced the deaths of 1.2mln Innocent Iraqis in order to "protect" its national security.... Mugabe is the least of our worries!! You are our biggest... The so called dictators in Africa are your own artifacts. You created them and so when they sometimes turn against you, do not suddenly cry in our name. The Sympathy of your citizens is also not needed for we recognize it as mere propaganda. Africa was once prosperous, once when your hands were off her. Should you promptly leave us alone, i promise you that any rogue elements, heads of states, and dictators will be liquidated as they will not be able to withstand the wrath of the ever resilient citizens whose efforts you currently suppress by helping those who serve your purpose; Meles Zenawi in Ethiopia, Idris Ndebe in Chad, Kabila in Congo, to name three.... Dear Reader, If you are not African, Your comment is not necessary.. I'm sure you recognize suffering when you see it, you are empathetic even and your heart may feign to weep for that hungry child... but you will never understand the nature of the truth... Suffering is our way of life... Your help is staying away....
unknown - stay unknown.
I am a true Zimbabwean, and I know what a dictator is.
You lose all credibility when you say, "Takunya happens to inflate the truth a bit, then he rightly does so"
The truth will set you free, and your truth is obviously warped.
You have nothing to say of substance. Stay unknown.
It is a great victory for SADC! All African patriots know what Tsvangirai really is: a "western stooge", an "uncle Tom" , a "House Ni....." The "Anglo-American agenda" in Southern Africa is being defeated thanks to the courage of the SADC leaders. Because of the "undeclared war" waged on Zimbabwe by imperial forces there are only two options left for Zimbabweans for the time being: peace,sovereignty and economic hardship under Zanu PF or war,economic plundering, and western military occupation under MDC-T. Zimbabwe IS NOT and WILL NEVER BE the DRC!!!!
With the help of the Almighty, Zimbabwe will recover, Zimbabwe will be prosperous and its "real enemies" will be defeated!Amen
Dear Takunya, your post is a clear evidence that dignity still exists among African intellectuals.
A West African friend of Zimbabwe
Femi, you are confused. Zanu(pf) is not going to rule forever. Where is Mabuto Seseseko of Zaire? Where is Banda of Malawi? They were some of the worst dictators in African history but they are gone. Its a question of time. Mugabe will be history very soon.
Femi, dumb, dumb, dumb. Look where Mugabe has taken your country. To the dumpster.
Ha ha this kjrs is afterall not even African but he want,s to mix with it and in the process has exposed himself.For your info Femi is not zimbabwean,and you,re a bloody foreigner,oh yes, maybe one intending to come steal and now that the zimbabwean policies don,t allow that he,s bitter ,go on and be bitter and have a nice time in your bitter condition, awt too we suspect is like him,anyway, HURRAH, and good wishes to the real AFRICANS and not the sellouts or some western descended people who think they own Africa plus the things inside as well as the people,you,ll all fail in your evil designs and we advice you to prepare stay off,a new dawn has come.We want similar changes in KENYA,SOUTH AFRICA, NAMIBIA, and other countries in Africa that,ve almost if not already being taken over by rogue elements from the west and their cohorts. African land and resources belong to African people,we can decide to do business with the world based on conditions that favors us, else, no deal with thieving ideologies and structures that,s happered our progress as a people and continent. We have hundreds of billions of stolen funds from Africa in the west,if they are so sincere as they claim why not repatriate the funds?no, they are always not to be counted on when it comes to sincerity and most especially when it bothers on their self interest to the detriment of the host country.We know your tricks and they,re running out,change in your ways if you want to have future peace with Africa and it,s people.
Do not invoke the name of God here but you are right with the Almight's help Zimbabwe will prosper but He does not bless evil and sin which is what Mugabe and the Zanu-pf are all about. Pray for Mugabe's salvation as well as those of the Zanu-pf then we will see a real true change in which will help the people of Zimbabwe.
The West is not waging war as you call it on the people of Zimbabwe but the suffering in Zimbabwe is a result of the Zanu-pf and Mugabe who has been in charge for over 20 years so you cannot blame anyone else for the problems in Zimbabwe...
Africa has once again showed their capabilities to manage their internal affairs without the interference of the West. When will Tsvangirai wake up and remove the leash that the West has so tightly around his neck?
The Only thing SADC has managed to do is keep the people of Zimbabwe starving and flooding over its neighbors borders, and you praise them for that. You officially look like an idiot now!
SADC knows better than a fool like you. It's quite amazing that the Tsvangirai worshipers can never find fault in their overgrown manchild. It is Tsvangirai that is stopping the conclusion to this ongoing crisis, not Mugabe. That is clear to every rational onlooker.
So its ok for Mugabe to steal $7.3 million for his own coffers? Its ok for Mugabe to murder 130 opposition supporters? Its ok for Mugabe to ban aid workers from helping opposition supporters? Come one now dBokk... have a look at what Mugabe is doing to the country. Its a disgrace and if you cant see it you are blind.
d_Bokk, yeah SADC knows to let Zimbabweans starve and be beaten by its neighbors. SADC knows that Khama has called for fresh elections as Zimbabweans are flooding Botswana and living on the streets. SADC also knows the the run off election was in on means free and fair therefore making Mugarbage the illegitimate presdident. I am a not a Tsvangarai worshipper but i know that any change will be better than what an 80+ year old geriatric hitler worshiping Murdering lunatic can bring. if that change isnt right then in the next election, vote him out. It is as simple as that, after all that is what democracy is all about. People like Takunya and Mabhiza are the only worshipers around here as they get paid and fed to rape and beat those who dislike how their country is being run. you can go on and on trying to defend Mugarbage the dog but even you and his fellow scumbags know how he has ruined the country and its people.
"I'm able to look at the entire situation in Zimbabwe and come to the conclusion that Tsvangirai isn't the answer, but just another turd wrapped in gold by the Western media. I'm able to recognize the shortcomings of Mugabe, but I do not allow emotions (like you do) to dominate over rationality." - d.bokk -
OK d.bokk lets put your rationality and cold hard analytical skills to the test; without getting emotional and without relying on the mantra of propaganda put out by Zanu-pf, why don't you present your evidence that the West has a leash tightly around Tsvangirai's neck? I am sure that many visitors to this site will be interested by your analysis.
He's just repeating bullshit ZANU PF propaganda... you know the "west wants to bomb harare" kinda nonsense... like the MDC supporters killing 130 of their own people to discredit the ZANU PF kinda crap. These guys are just blatant idiots that dont care 1 little bit for humanity.
Kazt, Why would you need D_Bokk to give you "evidence that the west has a leash tightly around Tsvangirai's neck" when you know the truth yourself? Who does not know that MDC is the project of the British spy agency, MI5? Only a fool like you or someone who is in perpetual denial refuses to acknowledge that money to created MDC came of the West Minster Foundation and was channelled through Amani Trust?
Who does not know that MDC still receive funding from the CIA and MI5. Bush and Blair, and Brown said as much when they told the whole world that they are working with and financially supporting the MDC, journalists and civil society organisations to effect regime change in Zimbabwe? If by now you do not know that money to finance the MDC is being channelled through these civil society organisations and NGOs then you are a daft idiot. Who today can claim not to know that Tsvangirai "swings" with McGee for 4 hours and that it is during these swings that Tsvangirai is told what his next move should be.
Tsvangirai refused to return to Zimbabwe to participate in the run-off elections, and it was only after he had been ordered by the American Ambassador, McGee, that he returned. A day before withdrawing from the run-off elections, McGee met Tsvangirai and ordered him to withdraw, although this was against the laws of Zimbabwe.
Tsvangirai refused to travel to Swaziland after being told by McGee and, while SADC leaders were waiting for him, Tsvangirai was busy swinging with McGee. During the just ended full SADC Summit in South Africa, McGee was there to lend his support to the MDC and before addressing a press conference, the MDC team was summoned to a meeting with McGee.
Why is the MDC procrastinating on the implementation of the deal which they signed in first place? Are you telling me that a learned lawyer like Biti failed to foresee all the huddles MDC is now talking about? The answer lies in the fact that the "...West has a leash tightly around Tsvangirai's neck" and will not let him do anything to jeopardise their regime change agenda. He cannot make any independent decision because they are pinning all their hopes, of reversing all the achievements that Zimbabwe has made, on the MDC.
The CIA and MI5 have predicted that, with the suffering going on in Zimbabwe at the moment, brought about by the sanctions that Tsvangirai called, the Zanu pf govt will not last until December 2008. They strongly believe that with all the hunger, anger and frustration that people are going through, there is going to be mass revolt that will propel Tsvangirai to State House. This, Kazt, is why the leash around Tsvangirai's neck will remain and become even tighter.
'...without getting emotional and without relying on the mantra of propaganda put out by Zanu-pf, why don't you present your evidence that the West has a leash tightly around Tsvangirai's neck?...." what part of this sentence did you not understand? Is the word 'evidence' confusing for you? Do you not understand the word 'emotional' or is it 'without relying on the mantra of propaganda put out by Zanu-pf'that is confusing you?
Katz, Takunya never has any evidence... his posts are purely a figment of his own imagination...
PLEASE IGNORE TAKUNYA_NDEBVU. HE IS PAID BY THE ZANU PF'S MINISTRY OF INFORMATION (PROPOGANDA DEPARTMENT) TO POST AS MUCH PROPOGANDA ON THE WEB AS POSSIBLE TO PROMOTE THE MURDEROUS AND THEIVING ROBERT MUGABE. IF YOU READ ANY OF HIS POSTS YOU'LL SEE THAT HE MAKES THINGS UP AND CONTINUALLY LIES FOR THIS AIM. HE HAS NO CREDIBILITY WHATSOEVER AND SHOULD NOT BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY. HE WILL CONTINUNALLY CLAIM THAT TSVANGIRAI HAS CALLED FOR SANCTIONS AGAINST THE PEOPLE OF ZIMBABWE. THIS CLAIM IS 100% FALSE AND DESIGNED TO ALIENATE TSVANGIRAI FROM THE MAJORTIY OF THE PEOPLE IN ZIMBABWE THAT SUPPORT HIM. HE HAS NO EVIDENCE OF THIS, AND WILL TRY TO TELL YOU THAT THIS HAPPENED ON BBC HARDTALK. IF YOU LOOK UP TSVANGIRAI'S INTERVIEW ON HARDTALK THROUGH YOUTUBE, YOU WILL SEE THERE ARE NO MENTION OF SANCTIONS AT ALL. IT IS SIMPLY A LIE, LIKE THE REST OF HIS POSTS. HE IS ALSO UNABLE TO NAME A SINGLE SANCTION THAT SITS AGAINST THE PEOPLE OF ZIMBABWE AND HAS NO EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT ANY OF HIS CLAIMS AND LIES BLATANTLY ON A CONSTANT BASIS. HE WILL ALSO CALL ANY PERSON WHO IS AGAINST THE TRYANNY AND GENOCIDAL REIGN OF MUGABE WHO ARGUES WITH HIM ANY NAME UNDER THE SUN IN AN ATTEMPT TO DISCREDIT THEM. SO PLEASE DONT WASTE YOUR TIME WITH TAKUNYA, HE IS A CLASSIC EXAMPLE OF WHY YOU SHOULD NEVER ARGUE WITH A (SELF PROFESSED!)IDIOT. HE'LL ONLY BRING YOU DOWN TO HIS LEVEL AND BEAT YOU WITH EXPERINCE.
Apparentley you are smoking and drinking something that has totally destroyed your mind. The situation you claim to be looking at is not even the problem. You Zanu-pf paid people cannot even make a convincing argument for Mugabe or the Zanu-pf you just show how easy it is to know the truth. All you are doing is help see that Mugabe and the Zanu-pf followers are nothing but a bunch og lying hypocrites who will do whatever it takes to stay in power and get your way.Tsvangirai is not the president of Zimbabwe it has been Mugabe for over 20 years but you still point fingers and blame someone else for Zim's problems. Mugabe and the Zanu-pf are the ones in charge so accept the blame for destroying Zimbabwe. What controls you is whoever pays you the most so do not give me that crap about rational and analytical thinking . Your so called HERO is anything but a hero just a plain and simple power hungry, corrupt president who has shown he will kill to get his way. The SADC is a poor excuse to respresent the people b/c they are a bunch of corrupt leaders who is afraid of Mugabe so they just allow Mugabe to do whatever. As for the West they have no control over Africa neither do they want it otherwise this would have already been resolved. So do not blame anyone for Africa's problem except the evil corrupt leaders who run it. Africa wants our money always but they want free hand outs but do not work for what they get sorry under that system no one will ever prosper. I live here so do not give me your same old line about the West so unless you have a convincing argument then start looking for a new job b/c you will never make a living at politics....
i AGREE WITH AUTHOR SIMON SADC WASTE OF TAX MONEY. SHAME ON YOU SADC FOR NOT SUPPORTING MR. TSVANGIRAI AND HIS FOLLOWERS THEY HAVE ENDURED SO MUCH, THEY SHOULD BE RESPECTED AND IN FULL POWER TO CHANGE ZIMBABWE.
THE WORLD HAS LOST INTEREST IN YOU AND ZIMBABWE. ZIMBABWE IS FINISHED AND WILL RETURN TO THE LAND OF DINOSAURES AND DUST SHAME ON YOU.
I SALUTE AMERICA AND MR. OBAMA, THE WAY THEY HAVE CONDUCTED THEIR GOVERNMENT I AM A BORN AFRICAN AND AFRICA WILL ALWAYS BE MY HOME BUT GEE WIZ AFRICA HAS A LOT TO LEARN.
Mugabe should never be likened to The Living legend - Mandela.Africa is in turmoil because of SADC, what have they brought to us if not for heartache, trouble, killings, rape . Greed is their norm, as long as they are nicely wrapped up in warmth they dont care about the pipo in the street. Let they burn in hell.
Once again, well done SADC for putting Zimbabweans and southern Africans first. Well done also for recognising Tsvangirai as the Western representative that he is and for not ceding to his conniving demands. He should be sent packing like the spineless boy he is with his tail between his legs and a handwritten note for his paymasters reminding them that never again will Europeans oppress Africans without resistance.
While the naysayers find it tough to swallow and almost impossible to stomach, the bitter pill and undeniable truth is that Africans continue to unite. Who cares more about Zimbabwe than Zimbabweans and their neighbours represented by SADC?
Tsvangirai could do worse than finding himself a nice abode in Amsterdam so he can hang out with his European chums on a permanent basis. Then he could visit Africa for his holidays and we all know how absence makes the heart grow fonder. At least he'd get a warm welcome when he visits Zimbabwe, just so long as there was no misunderstanding about him stopping and guarantees that the wolf in sheep's clothing that he is was leaving the country again soon.
selector wow you guys with the rest of the zanu-pf home boys how do you get this job? I mean you could not even convince a monkey to listen to your foolish words... Southern Africans and Mugabe care for the Zimbabweans oh yeah that is why millions are starving in Zimbabwe now, so what idiot is going to even listen to what you have just said. If anyone should be sent sent packing it should be Mugabe, Zanu-pf and the now SADC leadership for their power hungry, corrupt feeble little minds have proven they only look after themselves while their own people are suffering....
Selector, been a while. Nice to have you back. Do you really think that Zimbabwe will be better of under Mugabe, given the lack of international respect for the once hero of Zimbabwe? Than Tsvangirai, who can bring in help and start to fix the Zimbabwean economy? As I see it, at the end of the day, people will continue to starve under Mugabe and his corrupt thugs. At least with Tsvangriai there is hope.
Thandeka, While you may want to call Manhela a "...Living legend" of Africa or even the world, I, for one, have no qualms about that. I am however, worried about the fact that your "living legend" chickened out of South African politics leaving a lot of unfinished work.
At the time of independence, Mandela had the muscule to turn things around for the betterment of Africans. He did not. He could have started the ball rolling by advocating for the empowerment of blacks through getting their stolen land back, but he left before he did that. Xenophobic violence that we see today is a direct result of the skewed distribuation of wealth in South Africa.
Mandela could have done something about reducing the crime rate that is the highest in the world where no less than 1000 white farmers are killed every month by blacks claiming their ancestral lands. He could have held the bull by its horns instead of opting for short term stability that is sure to come to an end sooner rather than later as long as the people's grievances are not addressed.
Mbeki was poised to do something about it but was ousted by the western-inclined Zuma. Noone is ever going to do it because the ANC is now too weak, after the split, to change the lives of black people for the better. At the end of the day the people will have to do it and I shudder to think of the kind of chaos and turmoil we are going to witness down South and part of the blame will have to be put on the shoulders of the "living legend".
Cde Ndebvu - Madiba did far far more than could ever imagine.He turned the other cheek and in doing so gave the cause of African dignity and standing in the world an immeasurable boost. He will be remembered as one of the truly great men of his generation on the same level as the likes of Gandhi or Jefferson. His example of forgiveness and service ahead of personal aggrandisement is in stark contrast to that 'failure of leadership' in Zimbabwe. We should be proud that it is a son of Africa that is now seen as the foremost statesman in the world.
Ask yourself what will be the lasting legacy of Robert Mugabe? A once thriving country reduced to abject poverty? A once peaceful populace torn apart by political battles? A once highly regarded educational system no longer producing trained and educated Zimbabweans? A country whose health system was second only to South Africa's now no longer accepting patients and whose citizens are dying for want of basics such as clean water? A country whose government departments now require to be paid in foreign currency because the local currency has lost all worth? A country whose very system of government is decided upon by its neighbours because it has had no functioning government for months? Mugabe's liberation credentials are now well and truly over shadowed by his destruction of the country as he has sought to hold onto power even into his 90's. Some legacy wouldn't you agree?
allAfrica.com
10 November 2008
Southern Africa's leaders have told Zimbabwe's two main parties to form a unity government and to share control of the ministry which supervises the country's police force, but Prime Minister-designate Morgan Tsvangirai has rejected their decision.
[ See Article ]
"Total Empowerment!", "African Solutions for Africans!", empty slogans by a dying generation of liberation leaders who have shown an incredible lack of intestinal fortitude by ducking their heads in the sand and hoping the problem of Zimbabwe will just go away.
Because of the SADC's decision to side w/ ZANU-PF/Mugabe, Zimbabwe is now "totally empowered" to starve. ZANU-PF/Mugabe will hold ever more tightly to the strings of power. The "African Solution" is to allow ZANU-PF/Mugabe to continue to rape, torture and murder anyone who opposes them! Once again, African leaders have failed to solve one of their own regional problems, are they the ones who will have to clean up the resulting mess they have created? I think not.
Who is going to help feed the estimated 6 million Zimbabweans who will require food aid because of ZANU-PF/Mugabe's failed land redistribution/agricultural policies? Who is going to provide the HIV/AIDs drugs to care for the afflicted in Zimbabwe? Who is going to provide foreign currency to Zimbabwe's ZBC to stabilize a currency that is not worth the paper it's printed on? Who's going to fix the sewers so that people don't die from Cholera? Who's going to supply and staff the hospitals? The schools?
Will any of the SADC's members like South Africa, Mozambique, Angola be able to stem the rising tide of refugees fleeing Mugabe's murderous thugs? Will any of them commit to financing the large scale food aid that Zimbabwe will need as the country continues to implode?
Demonizing the West makes for catchy political slogans, nothing more. SADC has embarrassed all of Africa and has shown why "African Solutions for Africans" don't work. No one will make a tough decision, no one will pressure ZANU-PF/Mugabe for whatever reason. SADC has failed to provide an "African Solution", what they're advocating is no solution at all.
Problem is: Zimbabwe will suffer for the lack of principles of SADC. Then Zimbabweans will flood the countries of the very people who betrayed their hope of a new democratic future for Africa. Without strong leadership (as opposed to strong leaders....) Zimbabwe is doomed to more failures on the part of ZANU-PF's so-called "leadership".
As if we thought things could not get worse in Zimbabwe, watch out, here it comes. MDC-T is likely to back out of the GNU agreement, they owe nothing to the SADC. It's time for them to sit in "loyal" opposition in Parliament. Let ZANU-PF/Mugabe attempt to "govern" without their consent. Let ZANU-PF/Mugabe attempt to pass legislation through Parliament. Let Parliament begin to open investigations of ZANU-PF/Mugabe regarding political violence, ZBC "stealing" foreign aid money from the people to finance ZANU-PF activities. Force Mugabe to suspend Parliament and show his true dictatorial colors to the rest of the world!
In the meantime, inflation will continue to skyrocket faster than the RBZ can print money. The banknotes in Zimbabwe will soon have more zeroes than there are decimal points in Pi! Forex alone cannot sustain the economy - RBZ hasn't paid the mines for over a year, so the mines are closing, and RBZ is losing out on more foreign currency as a result. People are going to get hungry - including the Army and the War Vets and the Green Bombers.
It's almost like Comrade Bob and the Politburo are saying "let them eat cake", and we all know how that story ended............
SADC had a chance to stop this from happening, but they couldn't and now all of Africa, and the rest of the world, will see what a dismal failure they are.
"Total Empowerment!" for the people of Zimbabwe to starve, die of easily treated diseases or be beaten, raped or tortured to death! Be proud of Africa, Africans! You have shown the imperialist West your mettle! You have shown the world that you can handle your own affairs........... you certainly don't need any assistance from the neo-colonial, imperialist, running-dog capitalists of the West now - you are totally empowered!
"Total Empowerment!"
SADC should be shamed for showing its inability to align itself with the will of the majority of Zimbos! It's a total abdication of its moral obligation to promote genuine democracy. SADC is backing a monster, a murderer, an imposter illegitimate confiscator of power!
We should not be surprised if Congo is going through civil war and that it may in due course spread over also into Zimbabwe.
MDC should feel emboldened to return to the grassroot and cultivate an alliance with progressive forces in the region in order to promote the emergence of a new progressive political force that can carry forward the peoples' wish.
Down with monster Mugabe and his cronies!
As a matter of principle SADC has not sided with Mugabe but has made its own ruling. We now have a SADC position that the parties can now factor into their own decision making. In my opinion the parties must respect the SADC ruling for the sake of the people and not allow their petty pride to prolong the totally unnecessary misery and suffering.
The SADC is waste of our tax money. These leaders have blood on their hands and Mugabe would not be doing what he does if he did not have their support. Just a bunch of fleas sucking on the dying southern African country. Many see a democratic and vibrant Zimbabwe as a threat to their own survival. Its disgusting. The AU is no better. The only solution now is the UN.
Hey brother where are you coming from. You only believe in the whiteman thats why probably you are here to clean their old people. Whats so special about Morgan, remember Robert was forced by Samora to attend the Lancaster coference which brought all these problems we have. So what special about the uneducated, inexperienced big headed little man who wants to see the population suffer because he wants to be the headboy. Obama does not negotiate with bush because he beat him resoundingly at the ballot. Why did your little president bulk at the last moment, as usual . Whose lives was he protecting and only to kill them with sanctions and his stupid utterances. Whose lives when i lost my entire family at the hands of Smith. Where was Morgan when brave guys where dying in anthrax painful deaths. Where was morgan when peolple perished in the protected villages. Where was morgan when guys where being hanged in one wat trials. Suppose you will tell me it was war. Then its war now. Morgan is actually getting what he doesnt deserve. He may show some intelligence by speaking to his friend Odinga who killed 200 people to be prime minister. Morgan you will not kill anyone anymore. Go into parliament and show that you reason and you may get my vote next time. To my brother SADc is not useless you are.
sorry i wasnt aware that you only deserve to have the respect of the people because you fought in a war, geez the ancient greeks got democracy all wrong didnt they. Maybe we need world war 3 that every democratic country will have a legitimate president not long after. Better yet, how about you show some common sense and stop denying the truth about the Murderous fiend that the good people of Zimbabwe are forced to support.
simon where was the UN during Rwandas genocide? what have the UN done to stop bloodshed in Iraq, Afghanistan,Congo DRC,etc?
Some peope need o know what they are talking about before they write b/c the war in Iraq and Afghanistan has been UN approved so get your facts straight before writing them otherwise there would have been no war there.
The SADC now will have to accept blame for what happens from now on to the people of Zimbabwe. The SADC is here for what the first thing they do is allow Mugabe to dictate this so called meeting n which they were going to take a tough stand on this issue. What a stupid joke they should hold an emergency meeting and get rid of all of the SADC leaders. The AU will not do anything and look at what the UN did during the genocide in Rwanda so I have no confidence in them either. The only thing we can do is wait for Mugabe to die off which will happen only God knows his appointed time.
Simon, I agree with you that SADC has been a total failure with regards to Zimbabwe, and especially how to deal with Robert Mugabe. I disagree with you when you say that The AU has not been better. The AU was successful in Kenya recently and increasingly the African population is against inviting people from outside.
The UN is not the only solution. The UN failed to help in Rwanda, Sudan and the Conga. The UN can play a major role, and should be allowed to play a role in Zimbabwe. Naturally the Britons should play a role also, but again, they suffer from problems of credibility. Today the AU is virtually at an impasse with the UK, a natural ally of Africa! How do you explain that simon!
CONGRATULATIONS TO THE SOUTHERN AFRICAN REGIONAL LEADERS WHO ULTIMATEMY UNDERSTAND THAT THEY CANNOT BE FOREVER AS WELL AS THE THE ENTIRE POPULATION OF ZIMBABAWE BEING INDEFINITELY TAKEN HOSTAGE BY THE MDC LEADERS WHO ARE NOTHINNG BUT THE VOICE OF THEIR WESTERN MASTERS. ONCE MORE CONGRATULATIONS. THEY ARE GREAT!! GOD BLESSES THESE TRUE AFRICAN LEASERS.
The SADC has just sentenced the people of Zimbabwe to 5 more years of starvation, beatings, rape, murder and corruption under the brutal Mugabe regime.
There are some true idiots here who make comments and one to say the people of Zimbabwe are being held hostage by the West and the MDC is absolutely absurd. Mugabe is your idiot in charge so the blame starts and ends with Mugabe and the zanu-pf....God does not bless sin and the consequences for their sin will be answered for by each and everyone of them. I promise you there are no positive consequences to sin...
While the position taken by SADC to back Mugabe is regretable, I think the MDC need to realy decide the proper way forward in a sober man. Being an MDC sympathiser myself, I am usually conditioned to reflect issues from the MDC's view point. But their are certain things that the MDC leaders have signed in the past (with regards to the formation of an inclusive government)which make me wonder what they were upto at that time and why they should complain loudly now against things that were very clear from the beginning. Reading the Agreement with ZANU (PF) and the Mutambara party which Tsvangirai signed on 15 September 2008, you ask yourself questions why Tsvangirai and other MDC leaders decided to sign that agreement. For in the agreement of September 15, it is clear that the MDC will join a ZANU (PF) led government as a junior partner. The agreement gives Mugabe frightening powers: 1) to declare war and make peace 2) to declare a state of emergency 3) sole commander of the security forces 4) head of cabinet 5) executive powers. Tsvangirai would have to report to Mugabe regularly. If Mugabe is the boss of Tsvangirai what makes us think in a dispute over powers between a subordinate and a boss, a surbodinate can prevail against his boss? The MDC and Tsvangirai messed it up when instead of discussing Mugabe and ZANU (PF)'s exit from power they decided to be lured into discussing an inclusive government. Mugabe and ZANU (PF) lost the popular mandate on 29 March 2008. Thus the MDC should have stuck to its guns and insisted that the best they could afford for Mugabe was to be Ceremonial President (with no executive powers)and Tsvangirai to be executive PM with full executive powers. ZANU (PF) would have refused this arrangement and the MDC would have pulled out of the discussions leaving Mugabe with a crisis of legitimacy. I think after signing the deal on 15 Sept 2008, to be Mugabe's junior partner, there is no way Tsvangirai can pull out now. If the MDC leaders see their participation in the inclusive government as of strategic importance in the future, it's better they participate. If they see it as risky, it's better they pull out now. Going to AU and UN might be a share waste of time. At AU, Mugabe would still be backed by the majority of AU leaders especially the Arab North and Southern Africa (minus Botswana). Tsvangirai would be backed some countries from West Africa (especially Nigeria, Senegal, Ghana, Liberia, Siera Leone etc) and some from East Africa (especially Rwanda, Burundi, Ethiopia etc). If the MDC appeals to UN Security Council, Russia and China galvanised by the MDC's lack of support from the majority of African countries will not hesitate to use their vetoes to Mugabe's advantage. Could it be that the MDC's strategy is to wait until the implossion of the economy take place and hope that armed forces would be influenced to overthrow ZANU (PF)? But with close to five million Zimbabweans out of the country and sending remittances to their families monthly such an implosion might never happen. The security forces might also remain loyal to ZANU (PF). The MDC needs strategic thinkers now than before.
Zimbabweans will have to sort out their problems.Running away from Zimbabwe into South Africa or Botswana has not helped the country.It only leaves the bully to rule the Nation.I cant believe that the educated nation with over 30 million pipo has remained in oppression for decades. The International community is not in the habit of intervening especially in the African context because most african nations a quick to pull out the race and neo colonialism card.We saw in 1999 how the UN air lifted survivors of genocide in Kosovo to different european countries including the USA.And african genocide? well africa claims it will be solving its problems, so let it be and that is why nations have left it to the Zimbabweans to resolve their issues cos they understand it better.One can never weep more than the bereaved. Zimbabweans have the tendancy of having the victim mentality, to feel that they are the only ones who have suffered like that.No.Zambia went through a simillar situation in the late 80s and zimbabweans laughed.There was a time taps did not have a single drop of water and we drew water from the Zambezi.But Zambians did not leave the country.They stayed and fought and won.Zimbabweans must learn.They should stay in their country and peacefully fight for national development and building.But they run away to UK and mostly rich nations masquerading as victims of the mugabe torture.Why cant they settle in a country like Malawi or Zambia if they are running away from fighting?The answer is obvoius.Its disgusting to see cowards toyi-toying in London and Johannesburg telling mugabe to go.He wont!!I dont support mugabe or Tsvhangirai.If you want peace , fight for it yourself.SA wont do it for you.They have their own baggage to deal with.By the way, there are tribal complications in Zim between the shonas and Ndebeles that the international community doesnt know.Let Zim peeps sort out their problems so that we can once again see the most prosperous and educated nation in the region that we once knew and envied.
God have mercy. African leaders are dumb idiots, period. They don't have balls to tell the truth. How do you share something with a burry like mugabe? I'm still shocked by the decision reached by the incompetent so called leaders of SADC. What were they smoking?
Nkomo was forced to accept a similar deal with mugabe in the 80's; we all know what happened. He delivered 20,000 of his followers to the alter to be slathered by mugabe. You're forcing Tsvangirai to commit a similar blunder. How can you entrust a nation and the fate of millions of people to a person who is morally, politically, economically and socially bankrupted like mugabe? It says a lot about the leaders of SADC; partners in crime. You will be held directly responsible for the mayhem that will follow. You've given the green light to mugabe to slaughter Zimbabweans, and I hope you join the feast after mugabe's hunt.
It's no accident that Africa is at the bottom of the human chain: Garbage in garbage out. Idiots have hijacked the continent at gun point, and parading themselves as leaders and saviors, but their only interest is to enrich themselves at the expense of the people.
War, famine, conflicts, killings, dictatorship, stealing and corruption have engulfed the contenent because we have allowed stupid and idiots to lead us. They've no vision and love for Africa. We're stupid to allow these idiots self-centered egomaniac visionless nation wreckers without real manly balls to lead us to a future of nowhere.
We need to stand up and fight for our right to live freely in a humane environment without being pushed around by these burries parading as leaders. Africa need leaders with vision but not spent force revolutionally leaders. We need leaders who can create a peaceful environment and jobs for the people, and not just mere slogans.
POWER TO THE PEOPLE.
Contrary to Idi Amin, Eyadema or Mobutu, Mugabe was not "installed" by imperial forces.He may be viewed as an "authoritarian leader" of even as a "dictator" by the Western corporate media but that is totally irrelevant as long as he enjoys massive support among his constituents at home and throughout the African continent. Being "hailed" by former colonial powers or their proxies can in no way be considered as a sign of "good governance". Mugabe is an African hero, just like Mandela,Samori Touré or Samora Machel
For sure,Mugabe will die one day and Zanu PF may not stay in power forever. However as long as the "main opposition " will be on the payroll of Anglo-American interests and believe that Zimbabwe's salvation lies on the "self-proclaimed international community" MDC-T will continue to be defeated.
The question that should be asked is the following:
"Should a political party which is the creation of, and is funded by, hostile foreign forces, and whose program is to unlatch the door from within to provide free entry to foreign powers to establish a neo-colonial rule, be allowed to freely operate?
femi well just b/c Mugabe was not put into place by imperial forces does not make him a hero either. Mugabe does one good thing and started with good intentions but well has become corrupt and power hungry to the point he will kill people to stay in office or who does not agree with him so that does qualify him as an authoritarian leader as you put it. Many Africans see him as the same ruthless leader who will stop at nothing to stay in power so when he does die he will be placed in the same sentences with the names of Idi Amin and Mobutu. Do not place a hero title to this man either b/c what he once did was good has gone to his head and now all he cares about is himself. He could care less if the people of Zimbabwe starve or die as long as he lives his high lifestyle along with his wife. The biggest fear is he and many of the Zanu-pf know if they are not in power many of them are headed to prison for all the bad things they have done and continue to do. So maybe MDC is not the answer but they cannot do any worse than Mugabe and the Zanu-pf has done. Zimbabwe is at a point now which it has pretty much been destroyed by Mugabe and the Zanu-pf and has nothing do with the West. Accept the blame for destroying the country and quit blaming someone else for your problems. Mugabe and the Zanu-pf has been in charge over 20 years and you see where Zimbabwe and its people are now....
YEAH!! Long live S.A.D.C, Long live Africa.This is very good news for the continent of Africa and we humbly applaud this milestone decision to keep Africa intact and as much as possible from the sticky hands of plunderers and thieves.Hmm!! change is in the air.Takunya is a patriot,we know the uncle toms in here.Conclusively,Africa is no more free for all like used to be the case,we,re going to fight to protect our destiny and birthrights which has been brutalised by foreigners for their own personal interest.
You humbly applaud the suffering and hardship that this decision by the SADC has sentenced the poor people of Zimbabwe too? I can see you are against humanity.
There is no disguising the fact that this decision has been a resounding win for Mugabe. Leaving aside the fact that idea of their being a SADC meeting in the first place that was called to decide what course of action Zimbabwe must follow would have been a burning humiliation for Mugabe; he has demonstrated time and again that he knows his regional and local politics. It has also demonstrated that Tsvangirai is no match for Mugabe in this area.
Tsvangirai's admirable qualities such as personal bravery, firm resolution to do what is right and sheer doggedness have been offset by his inability to mix it with Mugabe in the game of politics. One example of Tsvangirai's naivity was the signing of the GNU agreement on 15 September when so much was still unresolved, such as the appointment of ministers and governors. Mugabe knew this and has been able to exploit it for all it was worth.
Now Tsvangirai is the guy under pressure, not Mugabe. However it would be a disaster for the MDC to back down and go into the GNU as a junior partner. Tsvangirai and the people around him must hold their nerve and let Mugabe form his own government. Mugabe will surely hang himself on his own rope.
As for SADC; this would have to be one of the darkest days for the region. The events of the past weekend really brings into question whether the region is ready to move forward or do we have to wait for a new generation of leaders to emerge who are not mired in the past, but who are looking to the future?
Dear Zimbabwean brothers, please be united on this fundamental principle of "national sovereignty". Regardless of your political affiliations you must reject as much as possible "foreign interference" in your domestic affairs. If you are able to stick to this principle your great country will be able to move forward and recover.
An "inclusive new Government" must immediately be formed so that the many issues faced by the people of Zimbabwe can find a swift resolution. If MDC-T does not want to participate in this "inclusive government",they should be left aside. Time is of the essence! Zanu PF must reach out to "sensible elements" within MDC-T who are worried about the situation of their country and who are willing to put their differences aside.ZANU PF would also have to disregard the negative reactions of the "self-proclaimed international community" when the government is formed without their puppets as the "IC" is not only highly discredited(e.g: situation in the DRC,Georgia,Afghanistan) but also extremely weakened because of the Financial Crisis.
MDC-T will shortly become a "spent force" because its "Anglo-American handlers" no longer have the means to fund it. The regime-change project was defeated on June 27, 2008 and at the UN Security Council on 11 July 2008. These two dates represent big blows for those who own Tvsangirai and his MDC-T. They are now even wondering if he is indeed "a good horse" as even "their media" are openly questioning Morgan's ability to govern (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/africa/article3663281.ece)
My advice to the Anglo-Americans is to engage Mugabe and Zanu PF so that we can all celebrate an end of this "dirty war" which is causing tremendous suffering in Zimbabwe.
What is the Dirty War going on in Zimbabwe? Could it be the repression of free speach, the beating and maiming of Women and children, the looting of the economy? If you are adamant that the West is unable to fund anything then what is the problem, they also will not be able to fund Zimbabwe to come out of this terrible mess that mugabe has gotten it into. So my clever friend what is your solution, the farms were taken from White Zimbabweans and given to Zanu officials, this was a total disaster as proven by the lack of food in the country. If Zimbabwe is so rich as you profess, why on earth is it such a disaster, the so ccalled santions are irrelevant (especially when they are only targeted against Mugabe and 150 other thugs. Stated by Dlamini Zuma) produce gold, platinum, steel, coal etc. produce maize and tobacco, cattle etc. I cannot understand what is so difficult, Smith did it with full economic santions and with a full civil war on his hands. There was no starvation then! Maybe with all the pluses that Zimbabwe has, rich land, minerals and other natural wealth, you have bad governance, thieves in power who are not letting anything tricle down to the populace. Maybe it is time for a change. Try not to be blinded by party loyalties!
It appears that both parties are not going to reach an agreement. Why can't these leaders step away and let new leadership emerge? All this fighting is not solving the problems that are facing the people of Zimbabwe. What a waste. A land that was once recognized worldwide for its farms and ability to produce food for other parts of Africa. How sad.
Rafil, Femi remains dumb, dumb, dumb. Zimbabwean or not, Mugabe has lead Zimbabwe to the dumpster. You say I would like to come to your bankrupt and disorderly country to steal of all things - please. For one thing dumpsters carry trash and for another, Mugabe has stolen all that there is that is tangible. Just because you have no concern about your own people, you find it difficult that someone like me and others who are not Zimbabwean, can have genuine concerns. With your attitude, you loose as no man is an island. How do you know that some of us are not very well involved in some capacity or other, with the food and other aid that has come to Zimbabwe worth millions? (only for your Mugabe to steal.) So shut up you ignorant self- absorbed idiot.
Southern African Development Community (Gaborone)
10 November 2008
1. The Extra-Ordinary Summit of the SADC Heads of State and Government met in Sandton, Republic of South Africa on 9 November 2008. The Extra-Ordinary Summit met to review the latest Political and Security situation in the Region with particular reference to the current developments in the Democratic Republic of Congo and the Republic of Zimbabwe.
[ See Article ]
This is a tragic day for Zimbabwe and for southern Africa.
The facts of the situation are: 1) The Zimbabwean economy has disintegrated over the last eight years under the ZANU-PF kleptocracy, leaving 4 million people-plus on the brink of starvation; 2) the people of Zimbabwe voted for the MDC during the March election; 3) as SADC's own observers acknowledged, the presidential rerun in June was NOT free and fair; 4) thus, Mugabe has in effect staged a violent coup.
To allow Mugabe to be part of a government of national unity is already a huge concession. MDC rightly insists that it would be betraying its mandate from the people of Zimbabwe if it does not receive at least an equal share of the power in the GNU. SADC has now, in effect, endorsed Mugabe's violent grab for power and has sent out the message that it will not take a stand against dictators like Mugabe who violate the sovereignty of their own nations.
As a result of SADC's failure to hold Mugabe to account, Zimbabwe remains in political limbo, with the threat of starvation and further disintegration becoming greater all the time.
SADC has also affirmed its rejection of worldwide standards of democracy, justice and the sovereign independence of nations to determine their own destiny through free and fair elections. This does not augur well for our future. May God be merciful to us and deliver the needy from their oppressors.