27 August 2002
Washington, DC — From Rwanda and Sudan in the east to Sierra Leone and Liberia in the west, alleged perpetrators of heinous acts of violence are under scrutiny, both within Africa and from world bodies like the International Criminal Tribunal for Rwanda. Pierre-Richard Prosper, the U.S. ambassador-at-large for war crimes, has the task of tracking those who has been accused of genocide and other serious violations of the Geneva Conventions.
In the following interview, he talks about the current status of these investigations throughout Africa, beginning with the detention earlier this month of Augustin Bizimungu, who served as Rwandan Armed Forces (FAR) chief of staff during the 1994 genocide. Bizimungu was arrested in the northeastern Angola town of Luena, where he was hiding among demobilizing troops from the rebel movement Unita. After his arrest, he was transferred to Arusha, Tanzania, where he has declared himself "not guilty" on ten counts of genocide in his initial appearance before the International Criminal Tribunal for Rwanda (ICTR).
Tribunal officials had described Bizimungu, who they accuse as encouraging and training Hutu militias for this slaughter, as one of the "top three or two most wanted by the Tribunal." But despite the capture of Bizimungu, over a dozen other ICTR indictees remain at large.
Prosper also discusses the prosecution of war crimes in other parts of Africa. Here are major excerpts from the interview with AllAfrica's Charles Cobb Jr.:
Was Bizimungu in Angola without the knowledge of the Angolan government? Why was he there? What does his presence in Angola imply concerning the 15 or 20 people that you consider key leaders of the Rwandan genocide of 1994?
What the arrest of Bizimungu implies, particularly as far as the nature of the people that we're looking for, is that it is a mobile group. We know that they've spent some time in the Democratic Republic of the Congo. We know that the leadership of the group has spent time in Congo Brazzaville. We know now, obviously, that some of them, particularly Bizimungu, are in Angola. We also know that there are approximately 60 combatants in Angola -- Rwandese combatants and we'll have to see who they are and if there are any indictees there. And we also know that some of these individuals have been captured in Europe. So what it is, you have a group of people who are not limited to the Great Lakes or central region of Africa. They move about in order to conduct their activities.
Well your 'most wanted' -- Felicien Kabuga -- is reportedly in Kenya. The Rwandan government charges that the Kenyan government knows where he is and is protecting him, or at least powerful people are protecting him. The specific question is whether that is so, and the broader question is that, given the spread of these fugitives which you've just described, how do you coordinate with the various governments?
Regarding Kabuga, all information points to Kenya. We've received credible information in the past that he spends time in Kenya -- particularly in Nairobi, Mombassa and Eldoret. Through our rewards program we've continued to receive information that focuses on Kenya. We do believe that he is receiving some sort of protection, either from a civilian population or influential people. We have strong suspicions as to who these people may be. We're not prepared to go public with it just yet, but we are prepared to make approaches to try to resolve this issue because we believe that Mr. Kabuga needs to be brought into custody and that the government of Kenya does have an international obligation. And we hope that they will continue to work with us to ensure that he is transferred to Arusha immediately.
Regarding the group as a whole, we really need to come up with a regional approach to this problem. The leadership group that is indicted by the tribunal and forms a leadership of the combatants in the Congo is a very mobile group. They have financial resources to move about. If we are to address this problem, if we are to bring peace and stability in the region, then every government in the region needs to play an active role and accept their responsibility. We are prepared to support any efforts that are launched to capture these individuals, and we are prepared to assist in looking throughout the globe to find these individuals.
Are these governments playing that role? Rwanda made the charge about Kabuga a year ago. What does the Moi government, the ruling party and the 'powerful people' have to say?
We have really put a sharp focus on this issue in the past few months. We felt that enough is enough. Too much time has passed that these individuals have been at large. And we really need to put whatever influence the United States has behind this effort to bring them into custody. Our first stop was in Kenya. I met with Kenyan officials; the attorney general was with me when we launched this program, and they've given their commitment to work with us. Obviously we need results. Though verbal assurances are welcomed, some of the actions they've taken on the ground are welcomed, but what we feel now a few months into this is that we need to step up the efforts and once and for all determine where Mr. Kabuga is and bring him into custody.
Is there a timetable for when you expect to have him in custody? Is there a timeframe for when you expect a hard and fast commitment from the Kenyan government or whatever government you need to get a commitment from?
It's difficult to place an exact time frame because there are too many variables at play, particularly the fact that these individuals are now on the run. They know that the area is becoming more and more inhospitable with each passing day. But what I can say with Mr. Kabuga is we feel we're getting closer. Our information is crystallizing. It's just a matter of whether or not the timing will be such that we'll be able to take the action that we need to bring him into custody.
With the others time is running out. While I can't say that others will be apprehended within the next weeks, months, or even this year, the situation has changed, particularly with the start of the apprehension process with Mr. Bizimungu.
We are waiting upon Congo Brazzaville to take action. We believe there are three individuals that are there. I have engaged the government on that, and we are expecting action. They have given us their assurances; not it's time to deliver. We are looking for President Kabila to take action and to search his country. He has given us the assurances to work with us. So we need that as well. If everyone does their parts then we should have developments in the coming months.
What happens to Bizimungu now? Indictment?
The indictment was issued previously for Mr. Bizimungu. It was a standing indictment, and the arrest warrant was served on the Angolans just last week. The next step is that he will be brought before a judge and arraigned on the charges that are filed against him and then proceed to trial when the case is ready.
Is that going to be speedy? The ICTR has come under sharp criticism for its slowness.
We hope that it's within a reasonable time. We voted in the Security Council (August 14) to provide extra judges to the tribunal for Rwanda so can move more efficiently.
How many extra judges?
We will appoint a pool of 18. Four will be used first as the initial slot, and we'll see how that process is managed -- if that is sufficient. If not, we will continue to add judges until we reach the whole total of 18 additional judges.
Which bring the whole total of judges to....
It brings the total to 34, counting appellate judges. We currently have nine trial judges and seven appellate judges.
While we're on the question of the ICTR, last month the deputy prosecutor said that Rwanda's attitude toward the ICTR had hardened, apparently because the ICTR, in addition to investigating the perpetrators of the genocide, is looking into war crimes of the Rwandan army, known as the RPA. Is it true that the Rwandan army is being investigated for war crimes, and is it your view that the Rwandan government's attitude about the ICTR has hardened?
There have been, in the past few months, some difficulties between the tribunal and Rwanda and survivors groups in Rwanda. The survivors' groups have a few grievances that they feel need to be addressed. The tribunal feels that they are addressing them. There appears to be a situation where the parties are talking past one another, [but] I think that we've moved past that now. The reports that we're getting are that Rwanda has engaged in this issue, that they have facilitated the witnesses traveling to Arusha. It's improving.
Be the first to Write a Comment!
AllAfrica aggregates and indexes content from over 125 African news organizations, plus more than 200 other sources, who are responsible for their own reporting and views. Articles and commentaries that identify allAfrica.com as the publisher are produced or commissioned by AllAfrica.
