Remi Diagbare
9 November 2008
interview
Not a few Nigerians have expressed delight at the rising profile of Nigerian models on the catwalk. Bearing in mind that class performance at bigger fashion shows is where the real challenge is, we sought the views of some South African industry leaders on their assessment of the models that participated in the recently concluded Nigeria's Next Super Model contest. See what we came out with.
I am Deon Redman, Creative Director, African Fashion International, organisers of the South African Fashion Weeks. I also work on fashion shows for specific designers in New York and in London, Milan and Paris.
Why are you in Nigeria?
I came here for the Nigeria's Next Super Model (contest).Tell me what you think about the show; the quality of the girls, the outfit and all.I thought the show was great. What I am really happy to see is how the people have supported the girls; that was really great. I must say that the girls from Nigeria have carved quite a niche in the market on catwalk anywhere in the world, beginning with Oluchi. It's time the whole attitude in the industry is changed now towards black models.
What was it about the first three girls that excites you?
I'll start with number three. I can't pronounce her name so forgive me. I told Joan that and she said we can call her Ayo. So, Ayo has such a unique look about her. She almost looks dull like she's almost like an Africa version of Kate Moss.
I've never seen anyone look quite like her. She's got a great presence on the catwalk - beautiful neck, beautiful body; she would really be able to hold her own and I can see people reacting to her work. She's what we call, in the industry, more of an editorial girl. An editorial girl is generally a runway girl. She's the kind of girl who shoots magazine fashion shoots.
The second girl, Macia, (is a) beautiful girl. Great body, tall, great proportion. The good thing about Macia is that she can transfer across a lot of different markets; she can look great on the catwalk. She can look great in a magazine shoot and in TV commercials.
Then, the first girl, Cynthia. Cynthia has something very special about her. I can't place my finger on it, but it's the kind of thing you react to. And it really came to light at the show. She's got a very unique look about her; a look that will capture people. Because really, this is an industry where you are working with creative people, respond to inspiring and interesting things. I believe that of all the girls here tonight, she has the most potential to be able to do that.
Is there market for black girls international - in South Africa, the US and London?
There are different outlooks when it comes to that. In terms of markets, South Africa is a very strong market for black girls because, they shoot a lot of commercials for the rest of Africa. Also, we have five fashion weeks happening in South Africa, every season. So, it's a great market for girls to get started. It's also a great market for girls to work incessantly.
Europe has a more specific kind of look, in terms of black girls. They want a girl who's incredibly unique; there has been a lot of discussion, recently, about the amount of black girls that we see at international shows. The belief is that black girls are not as well represented as they could be, which I think is right. But that is changing. There was a recent cover in June (edition of) Vogue; and they shot the whole black Vogue issue. They had Naomi Campbell, Liya Kidebe and Jodin. That was the first time in history that Vogue has ever devoted an entire issue to black models.
And I think that it's time. Africa is a strong contributor and it's time that is reflected in European magazine. The market in America is a little different because, it's commercially based. So, you find the girls who do really well - Tyra Banks, for example, who is more of a commercial product; and I use the word product because that is exactly what a model is.
The job of a model is to sell a product at the end of the day. So, people are looking for a person of their brand to push sales. And that's what I think. We really have a very good representation now. The three girls that we pushed forward cover the different sequence of the market and each one of those girls could progress. So, it's an exciting stage of their career to be able to go into a major market like South Africa and then see where that development takes them.
So, do you think the three girls have a good chance abroad?
I think so, I said to Joan before I came on this trip; I've been completely honest with her. Of the lot, there was only one girl that I thought no potentials.
But those three girls have great potentials. We will now go to the process to presenting them to designers in South Africa; to see the designers that respond to them. We have Thula Sindi and he is one of the designers that show in South Africa. He has responded very favourably to the three of them.
In fact, he was most impressed with Cynthia as well. And I said to him, should there be the possibility that he was in South Africa when the shows came up, would you use her and he said "Absolutely". He would open his show with her. That says a lot.
Does it mean that for a girl to make it internationally, she does not have to possess the regular African looks?
I don't know what the definition is. Africans perceive beauty in one way, whereas in modelling Europe might perceive beauty in a completely different way. I remember when Alek was coming up really strong about 12 years ago.
The response from Africa was not favourable, because it was almost like an insult that Alek represented African beauty. Alek was never successful because, people in Europe thought she represented African beauty. She was successful because they thought that she was individually beautiful. I have worked with Alek a few times and she is amazing. When Alek walks into a room, you cannot help but notice her.
Is she a beautiful woman?
I think she is a beautiful woman. Alek Wek has been one of those women that have changed the idea of beauty. It's the same way that Kate Moss did; Alek Wek did as well. There is a famous quote that says: the beautiful is beautiful, the ugly might be beautiful, the pretty will never be beautiful. What that says to me is that I am not saying that Alek was ugly. I am saying that the concept of beauty changes so much and it's about what inspires people at that particular time.
Alek was very powerful and was inspiration to most of the world's top photographers at that time. I think someone like Cynthia, for example, has something that could inspire that. She is by no means an Alek. She's got a unique look about her that makes how stand out.
I can tell you that looking at Cynthia a lot of people wouldn't pick her out as a beautiful African girl.
You wouldn't? I don't understand why you say that. Yes, that's why I want to find out what is it about her that makes her beautiful?
She's got a beautiful feature that is symmetrical, she's African.
Is it the typical African structure?
No. I don't want to say what the African structure is. I am always amazed by how different people look. You respond to the energy of a model, Cynthia's look is incredibly strong and would be perceived as beautiful in lots of other places.
Tell me what you do.
I am a fashion producer. I produce specific shows for designers in Europe and America. I am the creative director in South Africa so, it's my job to oversee all the shows - casting with producers, the girls, everything you see in the fashion week, I oversee. So, I am really excited to be able to take these three girls and show them to the producers in South Africa. The three girls are specifically in next season's fashion week.
Do you have any comment on the Nigerian fashion and beauty industry?
I saw the last day of the Nigeria fashion week. I think the Nigerian industry has great potentials. The thing with any emerging industry is that you need money. Fashion is incredibly powerful, economically, in the world. It accounts for 400 billion dollars on an annual basis. Nigeria, as a market and as an industry, is developing and emerging.
It requires support from, perhaps, the private sector to back the creativity, to back the modelling industry to be able to get them out to the rest of the world. Because, that's the thing with fashion; it's a global basis. You have to take your product to the world because the world doesn't always come to you. So, once you have taken your products to the world, then they start to realize the potential of where it comes from.
For example, someone like Oluchi makes people aware of Nigeria. Nigerian models need to how to infiltrate the markets in the world. And, I know in an emerging industry, they don't always have the financial back-up to be able to do that themselves. So, they need some sponsorship to do so. It's the same situation in South Africa. South Africa has grown substantially but, its exactly the same process.
Would you say having a fashion council helped the industry in South Africa?
Absolutely. Having a fashion council in any country helps that country. You need to have an objective, realistic and critical. And, when I say critical, I do not mean it in a negative way. I mean critical in terms of quality and output. You need to have that there so that standards are maintained. Because, you remember, we are part of the world. It's no longer a case of them and us.
The world is such a small place now and everyone, everywhere is looking for new ideas - from Paris to Tokyo; those places that have new ideas should put them out there to the world. So, fashion council? Absolutely. They all develop in South Africa; they have got regional councils, and in the process of developing the national council (as they have everywhere else in the world). There is FBA in America, the Council in London. It helps to regulate the quality of the industry and what they put out there.
My name is Christal Williams. I am the owner of LC Models in Cape Town and in Paris.
Could you give one brief description of the industry you are in?
In terms of the two industries, in terms of what you find in Europe and what you find in South Africa, I am a little more in tune with what is happening in Europe because I've been spending the past four years in Paris than what I have done is South Africa. When I was in Paris and attending all the fashion shows there, I realized that there is most definitely a market for Africa in the European market.
Because, I knew Africa quite well, as well as South Africa, where I was born and bread, I decided over a few years period to start a modelling agency and to try and find new faces. Not only new faces but also to look at the fashion designers that we have got on the continent.
I know Paris on top of the world in terms of fashion, but I do believe that in terms of Africa, we have got something new and something different to find; some of the things that I would actually like to develop on the international as well.
Did you come basically to Nigeria for Next Super Model?
I was very fortunate to meet Joan. She decided to come to South Africa and decided there was a market for it. It was about a year ago and Deon Redman, the producer of African Fashion International, was telling me about a woman from Nigeria that was actually looking for an outlet for black African models in South Africa.
Somehow, along the line, we did get together and Joan opened an agency in South Africa. Then, came the Johannesburg Fashion Show and Deon introduced the two of us and said, "These are the two women that I actually want to bring together; you are like union gang. It's like the opposite of one another and one white, one black but with exactly the same vision." Joan is literally using her life savings in what she believes in.
My other business is more on the oil and gas side which also ties very nicely with Nigeria but my passion is always the fashion industry, I have been out of it for about 30 years. And four years ago, I decided, it runs in my blood, there is no way that I can run away from it, I have to do something about it.
Looking at the girls, what is it about a model that makes her sell? What are we looking at?
A model is not specifically a pretty girl or a beauty queen. A model must have something that...
Yeah, what is that something?
I cannot define it. It's just something that I know when I see it or when I find it. No. 1 for me is the height; she must be tall, lanky. She must have legs that stretch all the way to the heavens. That is how I call it. Frank told me if I come to Nigeria that I will see more models that are on the hippy side; more round and round hips. Yes, it's an African thing. We have the same here in South Africa.
I think the whole of Africa, the girls are tall, beautiful and slender, and can actually carry themselves well and when they come to the catwalk, they define something. They give something that I cannot even explain; that I can't define even if they define something. It's just, when I see it, I know it and I know it will sell.
So, I am not looking for your beauty queen. I am not looking for your bom-bom or pom-pom girl. I am looking for that facial whatever...
Can't you give a name to that facial 'whatever'?
No, I can't. I don't have a suitable name for it. It's just my special something that when I see it, I will know. If I find the right name for it, I will let you know. But what I can tell you is that it's just a feeling.
Where she comes down, when you see her walk, you just know that she has got it. She wears the garment, she sells the garment. Because, at the end of the day, that is what a model is all about. She walks in there and she excites the audience.
She must be able to sell that garment and I actually think that some of the best models that I have come across are models that can re-invent themselves. Every time, she looks different, every time she came down the catwalk, you can't really define it. It is something I can not define and that is what makes a model.
Is there a standard for a model?
Yes, there is a standard.
What is the standard?
In European ways, the typical standard for a female model will be a minimum height of 176. Now I am talking specifically of run way models. Reflex is one of the things I am looking for; the legs. Then, I look at what she has to offer. It's by our uniqueness that we offer what we offer. But, I think we are still in our infant shoes. We are most definitely not were Europe and the rest of the world are specifically.
When I call Europe, I am talking about Paris, Milan. London, I don't think we are very far behind. Yes, most definitely, from what I have seen. I don't think we should be afraid that we actually surpass them for now. I think it's time for a fresh and nice approach. I also think we need to take a look at what is happening in the international market.
Number one, what is selling? What is working? A time is coming when people will actually say let's take a look at what Africa can offer us. I was born here, even though half of my portfolio is in Europe and I have spent half of my years in Paris but that even makes it more interesting because I can even market the African products/continent; because in my heart am so African.
With the girls that you have seen, what are their chances of making it out there?
I think there are a couple of girls that might have a chance to make it good internationally but it's a very difficult market out there. She has to be exceptional but also very much depends on her agent; on how well the agent places and markets her.
It also depends on what the market is looking for at that point in time. Sooner or later, people will have to get tired of the Russian models and they will have to look somewhere else like Brazil, which is already coming up. For me, the next possible market when other markets have run out will be Africa.
What is your profession? What do you do?
I am a model boss. I own a modelling agency called LACONTES MODEL based in Capetown and Paris. We market not only models from South Africa but also from Africa as a whole.
Rolyn What is your name and what do you do?
My name is Rolyn and I am a freelancer. I am a casting director for TV commercials, movies, print campaign and I have done that job for twenty-six years. And, I have crossed a lot of Pan-African ads like the one you seen such as Zain, Bank PHB, Visafone, MTN and the list goes on and on. This is my first visit to Nigeria.
Are all these people in this advert Nigerians?
No. Not all but anybody we are using must look Pan-African. We cast the people in South Africa, we shoot the commercial in South Africa and we plant in Pan-African countries such as Nigeria, Cameroon, Ghana, etc. We use as many Nigerians as we can but obviously, because of the nature of the business and the interest of other products, we don't really have enough people from Nigeria. We also use people from other Pan-African countries such as Congo DR, Cameroon, Senegal etc. or Pan-African looking people.
Since this is your first time in Nigeria, what is your impression?
Basically surprised! The traffic is wow! But you must learn to adapt to the situation at hand. In my place, we certain don't have the kind of population that you have here - which is one of the reasons we don't experience such traffic congestions on the road. But I love Nigeria and I am definitely coming back to Nigeria.
Why did you come for the show?
I came to judge the competition and to meet some of my clients that I have never met; Nigerian clients that we only speak on the phone. Also, to get a feel of the country. It's one thing to hear different things about a country and it's another thing to come by yourself to see the people, know their roots and compare with what you have been hearing. Then, you also understand the people more.
What was the quality?
It was fantastic.
The quality of the girls?
Fantastic. Unbelievable. The girls are so beautiful with bodies and attitude. Obviously, they need to be polished to a certain extent but they are beautiful.
What are the chances of these girls, internationally, for commercial purposes and for runways?
I think some of them are going to do wonderfully well. The winner is definitely of international standard. If she was competing with South Africans, she would be a winner. She has that very strong look. She is a natural beauty and that is what I love. Natural beauty, natural hair, beautiful skin, beautiful teeth, lovely body and a good attitude.
Most Nigerians are looking for classic beauty, what are you looking for?
We are looking for Afrocentric, not Eurocentric. Afrocentric means typically African, natural African beauty, everything should be natural. Those are the features my clients want; they don't want girls to look Eurocentric.
What are those features that makes a model international material?
Confidence, attitude and obviously, her looks.
What's the look?
The way that she looks.
Must she be beautiful?
She doesn't have to be beautiful.
Then, what must she look like?
You can't place a finger of what that thing is. There is no specific look to it, but when you see that look you will know it.
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