Daily Independent (Lagos)
Tunde Opeseitan
31 December 2008
interview
Tunde Odanye is a lawyer, a politician and a public affairs analyst. He was a former governorship candidate on the platform of the Alliance for Democracy (AD) in Osun State. In this interview with Tunde Opeseitan, he spoke on several national issues including the slogan of the present administration. He contended that the rule of law of President Umaru Yar'Adua is a ruse of law. Excerpts:
How would you react to the judgment of the Supreme Court, which upheld the victory of President Yar'Adua?
Very interesting I must admit, by the time you have a judgment at that level almost tied in number between the main judgment and the dissenting judgment, you can be sure the judgment would be well considered and erudite. Indeed, it can be seen that the case could have gone either way because both the judgment and dissenting judgment were well formulated, weighty, convincing and supportable in fact, jurisprudence, logic and law. I can assure you that it would be analysed, debated and cited by lawyers, law students and scholars for a long while to come. Indeed, I believe the Supreme Court Justices too recognising its importance and the legacy it would be bequeathing went out on a limb to deliver a most detailed and exhaustive judgment. Yet the judgment to my mind is so easy to comprehend and understand. For instance, the dissenting judgment saying Atiku was excluded while acknowledging that his name and party logo appeared (which was the sum total of the substantive judgment and Yar'Adua's counsel's argument) goes on to conclude that the hounding, frustration and delay in including him in the list of candidates was as much an exclusion in that he cannot be said to have enjoyed all the benefits of an early inclusion his co-contestants had, so while one dwells on the letter of the law the other dwells on the spirit.
And as to the main judgment, which said the non- serialisation of ballot papers did not substantially decry from the correct outcome of the law while the dissenting judges relied on the mandatory nature of the section of the electoral law that demanded serialisation of the ballot papers the lead judgment says it is forgivable by reason of the section that allows for substantial compliance as a defence/escape valve. It further exculpates on the grounds that all contestants contested under the same terms (non-serialised ballot papers etc) with different contestants winning in different places. Therefore, in their reckoning there was substantial compliance and the outcome/results reflected in general/overall the will of the voters. As for me as an individual, I am relieved over it because it has saved us from the trauma of another election the outcome of which we are sure would have been contested all the way to the Supreme Court and possibly beyond year 2011.
Talking about election petitions, what is your assessment of the judiciary?
Like everywhere else we have good judges, we have bad judges, we have corrupt judges and we have incorruptible judges. The funny thing is that both lawyers and fellow judges know those who fall into either compartment. The consolation is that the higher you go the fewer the judges and likewise the fewer the corruptible judges.
The problem is that our politicians are bad and sore losers so much so that because they all complain irrespective of the merit of the judgments given in their cases it is impossible for the public to properly assess the good from the bad judgments and judges. It is also unfortunate that like most things in Nigeria you find inept and lazy people lobbying to be appointed judges and in some cases they do succeed while the more able and better qualified because of its low reward system and opaque procedure for promotion to higher benches and unpredictable procedure for appointment of chief judges shy away from the bench. Lastly, in my humble opinion the general decline in the standard of education at all levels has affected the quality of lawyers produced and the judges. These days it is no surprise coming across lawyers and judges, who loath reading, yet the love of reading is a sine qua non for being an able lawyer or judge, as you are expected to read far and wide and possibly on every topic under the sun. Indeed, you shall read till you bend if you intend to do the work properly as a lawyer or judge. The rule of thumb is - a lawyer and by extension a judge is supposed to know everything about the law and at least something about everything else.
Some people have argued that the recent crisis that followed the local government election in Plateau State was an indication that our electoral process is still wrong. What do you think is wrong with our electoral system and the way out?
No doubt our electoral process is faulty regardless of Prof. Iwu's protestations to the contrary but the Jos riot to my mind wasn't just a consequence of an election but a much larger malaise, a failure and disconnect in our very nationhood. A country where the rich and powerful, who are supposed to unite us, but for their own selfish reasons seize every opportunity to divide us certainly, cannot augur well for our nationhood, its growth, its elections and everything else.
Until we have a complete overhaul of the actors whose vision does not exceed their immediate profit and who have absolutely no qualms about sacrificing numerous lives in maintaining their positions so long shall we continue to have episodes like the recent Jos riot.
I like you to comment on the recommendations of the Mohammed Uwais-led panel on electoral reform.
I'm sorry I am not overly optimistic about the effect of their recommendations on our electoral process. No doubt Justice Uwais is one of the most respected former Chief Justices of the Supreme Court around today, however, in participating on a couple of committees myself I have come to realise that recommendations abound in Nigeria on almost every subject under the sun tucked away in filing cabinets in various government offices, you only need to ask the civil servants to produce them for you. So, I'm not sure a similar fate does not await this panel's recommendation. Furthermore, have you ever seen a Nigerian government or political party implementing recommendations that might break their hold on power or turn out to their disadvantage? Again, experience has shown that until people understand that the group is larger than the individual and the country transcends a bunch of individuals so long shall the best of laws fail to provide the needed solution to our problems. The average Nigerian is so consumed by himself that the first thing he does to every regulation no matter how noble is to determine how it affects his interests and once it detracts from it no matter the overall gains for the larger group, he proceeds to disassemble it regardless of the effect of his action on the larger population.
Some states are now embracing the concept of Alternative Dispute Resolution (ADR) and Lagos State Government has even created a courthouse called Lagos MultiDoor Courthouse (LMDC) for that purpose. What is your take on the practice?
It is no doubt the way to go, but like everything else change takes some time to creep in. It is even more so in a profession as conservative as the legal profession. Lastly, on this point I personally think more should be done to create awareness of this concept and its workings and at a cheaper rate than what presently obtains.
Many pundits have contended that the high fees being paid at the Law School is a ploy to deliberately prevent the poor from becoming lawyers. Do you share the same view?
The practice of the law has never been cheap, this explains why law abroad was initially the sole preserve of the Lords, Noblemen, Gentry and their heirs. Its being expensive also guaranteed and continues to guarantee good returns by way of fees and standard of living for its practitioners. Law books are probably the most expensive in the world, we have law books costing over a million naira and single volumes costing several millions of naira, yet our law schools are expected to have these in stock in their libraries. I'm sure you do not want to know how much it costs to set up an average law office. Add the suits, the wig and gown, the collars etc it is by its very nature costly and expensive. Now, do the cost of having worthy lawyers on the law school payroll as lecturers and I am sure you would appreciate the Law School's position. They no doubt are in a conundrum, with the naira depreciating, prices going up and a sworn duty to provide quality service, the cost cannot but be high as they must match these realities.
Even in our days in the Law School in the 70s there were complaints and the response we got then were that the law is a special profession of noble and learned gentlemen, there are a lot of cheaper professions you are free to choose from, but if you want a guaranteed future you must put up with the initial inconveniences in the knowledge that you shall recoup your outlay many times over in a short time in practice. Do you know that in the past in Britain after paying your way through university, the Bar with its dinners etc, you paid to be taken the chambers you worked in for your tutelage? In other words, nothing good comes cheap or easy.
As a lawyer, how do you normally feel when governments disregard court ruling or judgment?
Of course, I feel upset like everybody else, if I am involved I continue to fight for as long as I can till I hit a dead end and thereafter I take solace in that ever so soothing piece of wisdom that says 'God give me the courage to change those things that I can and the strength to accept those I cannot'. Finally, I have always believed in nemesis and the fact that 'what goes around comes around'. Those who disobey these court orders themselves usually do get cut up eventually, you know that saying 'those who take short cuts usually get caught up' so it is and shall continue to be with those who thumb their noses at the law. However, while on this topic I would like to say this malaise is no longer limited to the government or its agencies, it now seems like a national pastime, do you know how many injunctions are disobeyed by landlords, property developers etc, the only difference is that while it is easier to enforce the law against individuals it is more difficult and a times impossible against government, but the sum total irrespective of who is disobeying is that it makes litigation more expensive, difficult and acrimonious, a carry over from the military days if you ask me.
The slogan of the present administration is strict adherence to due process and rule of law. How would you assess President Yar'Adua vis-+-vis his claim of strict adherence to the rule of law?
You mean the 'ruse of law'. The ruse of law that selects who is to be prosecuted for what, that distinguishes between the rich and the poor and the politically powerful and powerless in prosecution and enforcing the law. The ruse of law that has turned out to be a shield to protect and prevent past powerful public officers from being prosecuted, that has been used to scuttle high profile corruption cases locally and abroad. The ruse of law that does not recognise Nuhu Ribadu's constitutional right to head to the courts to determine or protect his fundamental rights, the ruse of law that fails to see that governors out of office lack immunity, but are seeking to investigate those in office with immunity, the ruse of law wasting everyone's time campaigning to remove immunity for serving governors with its near impossibility of passage while conveniently forgetting that if you make sufficient example of past abusers of immunity, current holders of immunity would be careful to abuse it. Please spare me. If anything, it has turned out to be a ruse, a big disappointment 'like an elephant giving birth to a mouse' (apologies late Chief M.K.O Abiola). Have you seen the rule of law in how the law enforcement agents treat you or other citizens, is it the police, the local governments, KAI, WAI, LASTMA, V.I.O's etc, please tell me where you see or meet up with this so- called rule of law in Nigeria.
What do you think of President Yar'Adua's new ministerial list?
No comments other than to say they sure don't resemble or remind me of Barrack Obama's list, having said that I would admit that there are one or two interesting new names on the list, but even those you wonder at their postings. I am not a tribalist and I am very much for a strong and united one Nigeria so I would like to believe there was no ethnic dimension to those questionable postings.
You ran for office in 2007, what are your plans for 2011?
At this moment I am enjoying my life as a private citizen, a privilege I haven't had in years. I'd almost forgot how good life can be when you are not carrying every body's problems on your shoulders and trying to solve them from your meager and hard earned resources. So for now I am enjoying my law practice, being able to budget and watch my expenses. While I no doubt continue to be involved in community duties and responsibilities, which have nothing to do with politics per se, life (apart from the general hiccups we all have to endure in Nigeria) is good. Nobody is flashing or calling me at outrageous times of the day and night, I don't have to attend meetings in outlandish places at outrageous hours and for those I am assisting they show real gratitude and genuine appreciation as against the politicians, who believe you are either spending the people's money you have stolen or you are investing with a view to going to steal and as such are never appreciative, caring or grateful.
Any initiative to assist the less privileged is viewed by them as another political gimmick because in fairness to them many had come earlier to deceive, use and dump them so they no longer know whom to trust. That unfortunately is the face of Nigerian politics. To answer your question directly, however, since I don't believe that politics should be cash and carry the way it is now, where past records (clean, dirty or otherwise) don't count, where winners don't win, where people view political office as a make or mar, once in a lifetime, do or die affair, I am taking a pause, recharging my batteries and trying not to despair and give up on the possibility of Nigeria ever achieving its optimal potentials and the greatness God obviously has in mind for us by giving us so much by way of human and natural resources. Because in my view the way things currently stand, the prognosis is not too bright, with our fumbling and wobbling along with the rest of the world, including Ghana next door going on full speed ahead. I am hoping very soon for the opening of the eyes of our people to the realisation that bad trees cannot bring forth good fruits at which time Nigerian politics might cease to be a cash and carry affair and the appropriate time for qualified, well intentioned Nigerians of proven integrity and pedigree to intervene and in the fullness of time produce a virile, most worthy and great Nigeria.
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