Lagos — You have been having running battle with your successor in office and incumbent governor Sullivan Chime, what is really the bone of contention?

You won't understand that what is going on in Enugu State is pure elitist deceit; it is a deceit of the elite; elite that is thoroughly disconnected from the masses; the elite that, for the eight years I was in governance were dislocated; they were dislocated from power. So, unknown names, people without antecedents, people who were nobody became somebody. So they can't forgive me; they cannot; I don't expect the Enugu elite to forgive me, because for eight years of governance, they were dislodged; they were dislocated. So the issue of surprise does not arise because whether you like it or not wherever you go to in Enugu today you will see me (my imprint); if you go to Opi-Nsukka road you will see me, if you go to Obollo-Afor-Ogrute road you will see me, I'm there; if you go to Ozaraezimo-Nkwere-inyi, you will see me; you will see me in the water project, you will see me in the bore-holes. If you come to Enugu urban you will see me; you will see me at Park-lane hospital; if your child is sick and you go to Park-lane hospital, you will see Nnamani right there; if you pass through the tunnel that decongested traffic between Okpara Avenue and Ogui, you will see Nnamani. If you use New Haven bye-pass you will see me right there; and when you are at Okpara square, you see me looking at you; I look at you at the International Conference Centre, I look at you at the Judiciary; so what surprise are you talking about.

So let's not belabour the issue; the issue of popularity does not arise; nobody can touch more lives or build capacity than I have done in the history of Igbo land. Check it, who is it? Okay where are the names now? The names that you hear that belong to the political elite, where were they before I came back from America; ask yourself, is there anybody who is a major player in Enugu today that was somebody before I came back from America. How many of them could afford a new car? How many of them could have their own homes? How many of them know the way to Government House, Aso Villa or National Assembly, so I have nothing to prove to anybody, it is there, whether you accept it or you don't, it is a historical fact; and you can't remove it. Because you cannot beat a child and ask him not to cry, they have to complain; they have a right to complain because its democracy. These guys were dislocated for eight years; it's like a baby clutching the nipples of the mother, breast feeding and you remove the mouth from the nipples, that baby will not leave you alone. So I don't expect these people to be clapping for me, praising me, it does not make sense; how else do you expect them to express their anger, the hostility, the denial of access they had. These were the exploiters of my people; these were the bourgeoisies, dysfunctional elite who exploited Enugu people for years, carrying CV's, doing contracts and this young man from Agbani shows up from nowhere and took power for eight years and you want them to give me a red carpet, they will not; because I dislocated them, including their children and grand children; I raised a new political class in Enugu, that is what the quarrel is. But the new political class I raised, do not understand because they lack the capacity; they lack the capacity to understand that I saved them; that I provided an opportunity that nobody could have done for them, but they can't understand; because psychologically they were not ready for where I placed them. How do you pick a man from the street, the next day he is somewhere; he wouldn't understand the efforts that went into putting him there. What did they give me in return; was it money? Was it vote? Was it connection? List all these people from National Assembly down to councillors, all the human capacity I built, ask yourself, was it money they brought to the table? You're in Enugu , was it connection they brought? Was it patronage?

Except that because of the situation you brought them into they are afraid to go back. They are all victims of poverty; they are afraid to go back from where they came. It's like a man who is in the rain, and you bring him into your house, run and go back to that rain he will chase you from your house into that rain. That is the Enugu story. So when people talk about Enugu , I just laugh at them because I cannot imagine any government that contributed in Nigeria than my administration. We had the World Bank bench marking, which is a scientific analysis of governance in Nigeria ; are you not aware of it? The bench-marking process that looked at governance in all the states, Enugu was number one. So what else? Fourteen ambassadors came here, did they come by accident? All of a sudden we are being demonized; we are being demonized for a reason; because these people were dislodged, the elite were dislodged and they can never forgive me for dislodging them.

But the paradox is, the inheritors did not understand. Those who do not know Pharaoh; that's the quarrel in Enugu State , but I am not worried. Because you can never change history; I will get worried if you tell me that Opi-Nsukka road does not exist; you tell me that Obollo-Afor/Ogrute does not exist; if you tell me that in history, there is effort of anybody in government who has empowered more people than I have empowered. My administration created Senate President, Deputy Senate President, Ministers, Ambassadors, INEC Commissioner, National Secretaries of Parties, Party National Chairmen; for the first time Enugu was producing all these people, you think is an accident? It was a calculated plan at human capacity building; it was also a calculated plan to build a new political class in Enugu ; a political class that has no address. Because I believe that the problem in our country like in any emerging democracy, is a dysfunctional elite; our elite is dysfunctional. Its deceit; they say it is anti- corruption; they only say it is anti-corruption when they are not happy with you; but if they are happy with you, you are managing resources well. It only becomes anti-corruption if the wrong man is on the job; then if your man is on the job it is not anti-corruption.

So, I pity the masses because there is a deceit going on; there is a deceit by the elite, a political elite of journey men and people who were at the right place at the right time; they did not earn it. Go and become a SAN and come and become a politician, then I know that you earned it; go and become a surgeon and come and become a politician; go and become a bank director, go and becomes a newspaper editor and become a politician, I will have respect for you. Go and be a teacher, a headmaster, principal become a politician, I will respect you, not a journey man; an idle man, who earned his position from sycophancy; from saying the right thing to the person at the right time, then they say okay become a senator, become a House of Reps member, House of Assembly, because you were at the right place at the right time. It's not earned, it was placed; it was political placement; so when a man becomes politically placed, he becomes disjointed, he doesn't understand because he can't take risk for the people; he cannot loose that job, that job is important to him, because that job is his name. He answered his name because of that position, if you remove that position he becomes nameless. His access to the society, his access to recognition, his access to putting food on the table is dependent on that job where he was placed by somebody, not by the people.

So the mistake I made was to apply social principles that have been studied in well developed societies, and tried to apply it in Nigeria . I go and bring a woman carrying sand, brought her up and sent her to the House of Assembly; or I go and bring a bad boy, brushed him up and send him to the House of Assembly; I am doing that because the democratic set up does not need for you to be literate to guarantee a say in the society. A transporter could be illiterate, the earliest transporters were illiterates but they were doing businesses, so the fact that somebody does not have a degree does not mean he cannot go to the House and decide whether a bore hole should be sited here; that was how I was building capacity; I was carrying my people along. But you must understand that part of the problem we have is anger against the elite; because the problem with our elite, is that we look down on those who don't have, who have not made it; that's the way our society see the poverty; that this man is poor because he is lazy, this man is poor because he cant work hard. And I said no, let me give you a name, let me give you a place in the society; let me place you, hoping that you will place others. But you now get there and others become fools; and you start destroying kiosks on the streets; you start clearing Polo Park , forgetting that the salary you pay them is not enough. That's why their wives have to stay on the streets and sell akara (local bean balls); and you say no, that you want the society to be clean, and then you clear them.

How has Life outside the Government House been for you?

Well, for the first time I can notice the flower glow, I can hear the humming birds sing; before I had no time to notice such details. It was hard, you were in Enugu with us; and why was it hard, it was hard because we were battling an elitist class. It was hard in Enugu ; they made things hard for us because we were trying to re-arrange society. That is it, that is the Enugu quarrel; that's why when I look at them, when I read some media reports, I just laugh because that is not my problem; it's not my issue, I have done my job. And you can't really judge me now; it's too early to judge me. They are going to judge me in 25 years, in 50 years and they will say ah, this Ebeano tunnel what was on this man's mind? What was the engineering set up? How did he re-channel the water? How much concrete; what of the rod? People will study it. They will look at Park-lane why was it sited there? Look at the buildings, what was the guy thinking? Judiciary, Conference Centre, tea-cup on a saucer, all glass; dualization of Ogui Road , dualization of New Haven , dualization of Rangers Avenue . Then come to ESUT; what informed him to build ESUT; you move in and the university is there with you. Then look at Air-Force, look at Law School ; what was the income of the state government then? Then it will hit them, they will start seeing all these names; Governor this, Senator this; what were they before Nnamani came into the picture. In-fact they were nobody; and history will now judge me. Because the greatest thing you can build is human capacity; because it is human capacity that will channel infrastructural capacity.

So the issue in Enugu was about few people, few retired people, who controlled the resources of my people because presumably they were involved in the emergence of Enugu State and Enugu could not say thank you enough. Thank you, thank you, 10 years, 15 years, and 20 years was not enough. They had to control the will of my people, subjugate them as long as they live. They have to decide who is what: who becomes governor, who becomes commissioner, who becomes local government chairman; they have to control access to the power base in Abuja ; and this chief comes from America and dislodges everything and you want them to be happy. And the beneficiaries, lacking the moral fibre to take risk, and defend what they have, think along with those who supposedly control the political process in order to survive. Because some of them if you dislodge them cannot do anything; there are some of them if you dislodge them now, 95% of them, they can't do anything. If you think I'm wrong, mention one person in the political class, who if you dislodge now is sure of riding a new car five years from now.

Are you talking about SAN's, are you talking about surgeon's, are you talking about school principals, so when I see journalists write what they write I take it as my cross. Every man must carry his cross and God cannot give you a cross you cannot have. So if the cross I have to carry is the fact I produced all these people, its not betrayal of me; you are not betraying me, you are betraying yourself; because my place in history is assured; you can't deny that. Because you have to ask each of these people, what were they before I came back from America ? Once they answer that question, who appointed you? Who placed you? Where you placed because you were more educated, you were brighter, you had more money, you had more votes, or you had more connections? You were placed because God ordained it so; but the fact that God ordained it so does not mean that you cannot recognize that God worked through people.

So, you can make as much noise you want to make, if you have headache, you end up at Park-lane hospital, you see me; if your children are in ESUT you are seeing me; you can hate me; if you have any emergency and you pass through the tunnel I'm right there. And then you said that Enugu never worked; how can you be where you are if Enugu never worked? If Enugu never worked, then you will be a passenger. You are where you are because Enugu worked.

What are your plans for 2011?

Well its obvious; 2011 is election and as the politicians say I'm consulting my people. Maybe at the end of Ramadan fasting, I will declare my position about 2011 like other politicians have promised.