Washington, DC — Earlier this month, the Africa Center for Strategic Studies organised a Senior Leader Seminar which brought together military and civilian leaders from all over Africa to discuss issues related to security. Nouzha Skalli Bennis, member of the PPS, Morocco's former communist party, and municipal counsellor from Casablanca, represented the Democratic Association of Moroccan Women at the conference. She spoke with allAfrica.com about her work. Excerpts of the conversation in English translation follow. For a full text, in French, see [Comment les marocaines voient le changement démocratique au Maroc?]
Q: The conference came at a time when the 11 September attacks are still on everybody's mind. The Moroccan government, led by the Socialist Union of Popular Forces (USFP), initially showed a lot of interest in reforming the status of women but it seems to have backtracked in the face of opposition from the Islamists and other conservative forces in the country. Many people in Morocco, and elsewhere in the Muslim world, say gender equality is a Western value and consider the West as being anti-Islamic. Can you describe the effects of 11 September on your struggle for women's rights in Morocco?
A: One effect of the 11 September attacks is that they drew attention to the situation of women in Afghanistan. Before that date, apart from observers of Afghan issues, very few people knew anything about the fate of women there. As Morocco's King Mohammed said, they were prisoners inside the garb they wear. Of course, we can also see 11 September as a response to frustrations caused by unbalanced US policies in the Middle East.
Equality of the sexes is not a Western monopoly. On the contrary, if we dig deep into our cultural sources, we will find that the "feminist" movement, which contested the situation of women and aspired to equality, existed at the time of the Prophet Mohammed. The Koran itself used the words "believers" and "Muslims" in the feminine as well as the masculine in response to contesting women who went to the Prophet and expressed their grievances as women. Those who currently say that equality of the sexes is a Western concept are looking for a pretext to discard women's demands and delay dealing with them indefinitely. Moroccan women's grievances go back a long time but they have become more obvious now.
Q: Do you think the majority of men, or even women, in Morocco support you?
A: I don't think the majority of Moroccan men associate equality of the sexes with the West. I have never had the feeling that 11 September, for example, has provided the majority of Moroccan men with another pretext to shut us up. On the contrary, we feel there is some sort of sympathy today which did we did not sense before, although decision-makers lack political courage to speak out and say women's rights have to be recognized. There is a soft approach by decision-makers to a perceived resistance from ultra-conservative forces in society, as represented by the extremists who are "allergic" to anything that may constitute a project of change in women's situation in Morocco.
Q: That may be so, but women's associations in Morocco are also accused of dodging issues thought to be too sensitive from a religious and political point of view. Take the issue of inheritance, for example. Islam stipulates that a man shall inherit twice as much as his sister does after their father's death. Womens association's may not be happy with that stipulation, but they are not saying it in public, are they?
R: It's true the inheritance issue was not part of the government's action plan. There are no demands relating to it either in that plan or in the Spring of Equality platform, which we set up to coordinate among women's associations. Although the door of interpreting religious texts remains open and should not be closed, we do not pose the issue of inheritance because there many, many other things that need to be done for women without raising an issue like that. On the other hand, we do raise the issue of common property acquired through years of marriage. We have many concrete examples of women who worked all their lives and acquired property jointly with their husbands, but when they divorced, they lost everything and found themselves homeless. In our society, women shy away from raising the issue of common property before the wedding takes place because, culturally, there is some sort of 'fusion' between the wife and her husband who, in the case of divorce, easily walks away with property he jointly owns with the wife. That is something we reject. It's a grave injustice which must be terminated.
Q: That's the legal aspect of the situation. What about the political aspect? The government's plan to reform women's status was first mentioned almost two years ago but later, reports said, it was sort of shelved. Where does it stand now?
R: The King set up a consultative commission with a task to revise the Moudawana or the Family Code. The process consisted of holding talks with all political parties and women's associations in order to hear their proposals and try to synthesise them. However, the consultations proved too broadbased and we felt they faced the risk of getting bogged down. Our reaction as women was to set up the Spring of Equality platform to unite all points of view. For us, the fact that the royal commission was set up does not mean we should stop struggling for our rights. Besides, when he met us on the occasion of setting up the commission, the King himself told us something to the extent that he counted on us to help him bring about change and overcome resistance to it from social forces opposed to women's equality.
Q: One issue you seem strongly committed to is women's representation in parliament and other state institutions. Explain why Moroccan women's associations are unhappy about that issue?
R: We know that the situation of women in Morocco is completely anachronistic when it comes to representation in decision-making bodies. This situation is in sharp contrast with the fact that women exercise various professions and enjoy a high level of competence that got them there in the first place. In all the presigious professions -- there are women doctors, paharmacists, teachers, lawyers, judges, pilots etc -- women are sometimes represented at more than 50%. But when it comes to decision-making positions, women are totally excluded. For example, in parliament, only 0,5% in the House of Representatives are women. Out of 325 seats, women occupy only two. In the Senate, again, out of 275 seats, only two are occupied by women. At the municipal level, only 0,34% of counsellors are women. In the government, there is only one woman who is minister delegate, which is not even a fully-fledged portfolio. This at a time when world female parliamentary representation stands at 13,8%. In sub-saharan Africa, it's 12%, the Arab world 4,6%. Morocco is bottom of the list just before five countries which have zero woman-representation, namely Djibouti, the Comoro Islands, the United Arab Emirates, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia.
Q: Why do you think Morocco is so lagging behind?
R: There are several reasons. One of them is a certain feeling of selfishness which has kept doors closed to women. We had our first two parliamentarians ever in 1993. And instead of considering that beginning a base worth enlarging, people thought two were enough. In other words, women were politically prevented from progressing. However, the main reasons are cultural, economic and psychological. Women have not really felt they have a chance to reach decision-making spheres. They saw the horizons were very narrow in this regard.
Q: Elections, often described as crucial for the country's political and social future, will be held next September. Do you think that they will lead to a real change in women's situation?
R: I have to say that there are some signs of change. First of all, King Mohammed VI has shown quite clearly he wants change by appointing women to some key positions. For the first time ever, a woman was appointed a royal advisor. That is not an insignificant development. Also, many political parties now have women in their political bureaux and central committees. Some parties which had only three or four women now have thirty or thirty five. That is a significant change. As for the forthcoming elections, I would say there won't be any real change unless certain measures were deliberately taken to favor the election of women. What is at stake here is the whole issue of development in the country. A country that ignores the needs of its women is a country that also ignores the need of its children, because mothers are closer to children's needs obviously. In Morocco, women and children constitute 67% of the population.
Sign up for free AllAfrica Newsletters
Get the latest in African news delivered straight to your inbox
Q: Since you mentioned representation in Africa, cultural debate in Morocco over the past twenty five to thirty years has focused either on what is going on in Europe or the Middle East and, to a large extent, ignored what has been happening in sub-Saharan Africa. Should one read in that a willingness by Moroccans to ignore their strong African roots?
A: Let us say that Morocco, in its recent history, unfortunately "missed" an opportunity, by withdrawing from the Organization of African Unity (OAU) [in protest at the admission of the Polisario Front]. That decision, although there were historical reasons for it, deprived Morocco of a framework in which to express solidarity with Africa and to hold meetings, exchanges etc. That does not mean Morocco has severed all ties with sub-Sharan Africa. There are a lot oif bilateral relations being developped, but there are also a lot of African regional forums in which Morocco is not present because of the fact it had withdrawn from the OAU. This is an issue that needs to be developped further. Morocco is a Muslim country that belongs to the Arab world and to the African world. There is a lot more to be gained from a multiple identity than from a single identity.
