On August 13th, I was the guest of Ministry of Youth, Ekiti State and the Association of Nigerian Authors (ANA) Ekiti State chapter.
I was invited for a book reading to commemorate International Youth Day. The event was Chaired by Her Excellency, Dr Olayemi Oyebanji, First Lady of Ekiti State. There was an engaging panel discussion, which featured Mrs Fola Richie Adewusi, Professor Lara Owoeye, Dr Ayomide Olanipekun and Mr Ayobami Durodola. The panel discussion was followed by an interactive session with the audience. This is an abridged transcript of the discussion. It was so great to be back home in Ekiti State, the Land of Honour.
The feminist movement believes that partnerships with the male gender is indispensable and important for victory, yet we know this can be difficult. What are you doing to involve men in this work?
It is not possible to achieve a more equitable society if women and men are not partners in progress. I have enjoyed significant support from men not only at a personal level from the men in my life, but the male policy makers, legislators, traditional rulers, religious leaders, and male heads of institutions I have worked with to achieve many gains. However, it is naïve to expect that all men will be willing to work with women to achieve change.
The issue of including men in the conversations we are having is critical, but it is men who need to take ownership of how they can talk to other men and set examples for them. The vast majority of men pay lip service to the issues we care about and many think hell will freeze over before they acknowledge the rightful place of women. As the primary beneficiaries of patriarchy, we cannot simply expect men to agree to the new order we want to see.We will keep working with men who also want to see change happen, knowing that it is the only way our societies can develop. We are also investing in raising our sons and daughters differently so that the results are not the same.
One of the agendas that comes with feminist agitation is the possibility of sacrificing merit in fulfillment of quota systems. How do we ensure we do not use quota systems to deprive men of opportunities?
The assumption that Quota systems or Affirmative Action equates sacrificing merit is a false narrative which needs to be fiercely resisted. In the past fournational electoral cycles, Nigerian women have gone from bad to worse. We now stand at less than 4% of women in the National Assembly, and there are some State Houses of Assembly where there are no women at all. Nigerian women will continue to beg and appease political leaders if we do not ensure that there are legal guarantees for effective representation and participation specifically through affirmative action and quotas. We should always remember that in spite of the many constitutional guarantees of equality of citizens, there is no level playing field out there. Without concrete and proactive measures such as affirmative action and quotas, we will continue to see dismal statistics of women inpolitics, governance and public life generally.
The demands of feminists seem to be in conflict with cultural demands from a woman in Africa. How does the feminist movement intend to strike a balance without families breaking down under the quest for female independence?
Women are entitled to a livelihood, a career and to success, just like men are. Being an accomplished woman does not have to be incompatible with being in a mutually respectful intimate-partner relationship. Women do not have to be cowed, threatened or beaten into submission. We need to bring up our girls with self-esteem and confidence. This is the first thing that gets taken away from them. We also need to bring up boys with a different understanding of masculinity. We should stop fueling the narrative that an educated and ambitious woman is a dangerous being.
This literally leads to rising cases of femicides at home and abroad. Being a Feminist does not make you rude, crude or disrespectful, and if this is who you are as a person, do not use feminism as an excuse. Feminism makes you assertive, firm and intolerant of injustice. It gives you choices and a voice. It does not make you a nasty piece of work. Misogynists and chauvinists will always have their own agenda to deny women space, rights and voice, so while on the one hand, we can continue to try and change mindsets and behaviours, we also need to conserve our energies for productive endeavours.
I know that you don't subscribe to feminist qualifiers but considering the fact that theories exist in forms and inclusion and expansion come by means of variants, feminism itself is indubitably made of many variants, what would you like your principles of feminism to be called? For example, in consideration of future feminist researchers and scholars who would classify Simone de Beauvoir for Existentialist Feminism, Angela Davis for Marxist Feminism and Alice Walker for Womanism and so many more, would you reconsider and give a lead on how your feminist ideology should be described?If only a modifier?
You are right, I do not subscribe to feminist labels and qualifiers. The feminist movement is not homogenous, and has allowed itself to grow and learn over time, taking the experiences, contexts and voices of feminists who experience patriarchy differently all over the world. Having said that, I am a Feminist who is African, and whose world view is shaped by Africa's experience of community, colonialism, nationalism, globalisation and how patriarchal power affects the lives of women in this context. I also believe Intersectionality is key to all the work that I do, as a Feminist from the global South.
One of my mentors, Professor Angela Miles at the University of Toronto, wrote a book years ago on Integrative Feminism. Her main thesis was that feminist theory and practice cannot be confined to one school of thought, regardless of how passionately we feel about these schools. So, whether we are Liberal, Marxist, Radical, Black, African Feminists, Womanists, STIWANISTS, Motherists,Snail-Pace Feminists, Nego-Feminists, there is a common thread that we can weave which supports the contexts we are dealing with.
I am a Feministwho appreciates the need to use a wide variety of tools for analysis, learning, teaching, writing, advocacy and negotiation, to achieve concrete results. I have been a combination of all the above schools of thought based on context and what I am dealing with. If there is a need to add a variant of my own, then I would introduce Wrapperism. From my essay and subsequent expansion of the thinking around 'Where is your wrapper?' I am interested in how we use the power of feminist numbers and agency and the platforms we occupy, to demand change,minimise toxicity in the society, and relearn what it means to be human as men and women.
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On the title of the book, 'Demand and Supply', there is a deficit in the 'supply' of women aspiring to leadership positions politically. Can you tell us if there's anything you intend to do to remedy the situation? I mean would you be going for any such posts come 2026 or 2027 for instance? How do you intend to move from theory into practice in this regard and be a feminist political leader?
I can be a feminist political leader without running for office. The fact that I have been on the frontlines of advocating for women in political leadership does not mean that I want to be in political office myself. I believe I have demonstrated in theory and practice, what it means to provide political space for women. When my husband, Dr Kayode Fayemi, began his political journey in Ekiti 20 years ago, it was hard to find a woman as Chair or even Vice-Chair of a local government. Now, there has been a huge shift in the political landscape of Ekiti as far as the inclusion of women is concerned and I would like to believe I played a key role in making that possible.
On Kamala Harris, let me quote two portions of the essay before I ask this question. i. 'Her time will come'(Pg113), ii. 'Should Biden decide not to contest again in 2024, Kamala Harris has a direct shot at the White House with the strongest credentials possible' (Pg 116).Can you tell us about your writing inspiration apart from the thought process, is there any muse that inspires you and spurs you on to such prolificacy and accuracy of assessment and prediction?
·*Bisi Adeleye-Fayemi is a Gender Specialist, Social Entrepreneur and Writer. She is the Founder of Abovewhispers.com, an online community for women. She is the First Lady of Ekiti State, and she can be reached at [email protected]
