In this interview with some media executives in Gusau, the state capital, Governor Dauda Lawal spoke on a wide range of issues affecting the state as it marks its 30th anniversary of creation. Excerpts:
As governor of the state for the past three years, what would you say has been the greatest hurdle to Zamfara's development?
I would say it is leadership because each leader comes with a different perception and way of doing things.
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The reality is that Zamfara State, right from its creation, had serious challenges. That is the reality of what it was until we came on board and began to look at the reality and ask: Is this how it should be?
Look at infrastructure, education, healthcare and agriculture, where we have comparative advantages. These were big challenges for the state.
So, we started making conscious efforts to face reality head-on and put certain things in place.
I am sure you have gone around the state capital within the last one or two days, and you can see the kind of development that is taking place. It is an ongoing process in Zamfara State.
There are so many other things that were supposed to have been done but were not properly put in place. This is where we are now, laying the foundation for a better Zamfara State that will be able to compete with any state in Nigeria.
You spoke about the fear people have whenever they hear that someone is coming to Zamfara. Three years after, how do you see Zamfara now?
This is exactly what we are trying to do -- perception management. We want to tell people that there are good things in Zamfara State and that there are good people here. There is freedom of religion in Zamfara State.
We have a lot of people from the South-West. In fact, if you go to the Sabon Gari area, it is predominantly inhabited by Yoruba people. If you go to Tudun Wada, it is predominantly inhabited by Igbo people.
There are also other tribes from across the country.
That is what we are doing right now -- changing that mindset and perception of Zamfara.
As far as Sharia is concerned, there is nothing different from the way we do things. It is the way the whole thing was pronounced and portrayed to the people that gave the state that negative impression.
Just like when you hear about insecurity, you think everybody is living in a war zone and that people do not even exist. The reality is that it is not the case.
If you go through other local government areas, it is the same thing. So, yes, we are working on changing that perception.
Like I always say, we will not be defined by insecurity. Rather, we should be defined by the comparative advantages we have as a state.
Look at critical minerals. Today in Nigeria, if you speak about critical minerals, Zamfara is number one. We have seen it, tested it, and we have the data.
That is why investors are now scrambling to come into Zamfara State and put their money here.
How do you imagine somebody coming into Zamfara if he knows that his return on investment is going to be uncertain? People invest because there is a clear understanding that something good will come out of it.
So, this is the new Zamfara, and this is what we are doing. We will continue to tell the world that Zamfara is not about Sharia. Zamfara is not about insecurity.
There are good things in Zamfara State, and those things will attract investment.
By putting the right infrastructure in place and making the environment conducive for investment, people are beginning to understand that Zamfara is not about insecurity and is not about Sharia.
Does changing the narrative also inform the change in your development model? Zamfara used to be known mainly as a farming state, but now it is being projected as a state of farming and solid minerals.
Before I even went into this contest to become governor of Zamfara State, I had done my homework to understand the key things in Zamfara State -- the advantages we have and what we can do differently.
How do we bring the state out of all the negative issues that have been out there in the media? That was the first thing.
That is why, when you look at our slogan, it is called "Rescue Mission". Under the Rescue Mission, we have six agendas.
One is security, two, education; healthcare; agriculture; infrastructure; and human development.
This is what we are doing right now. I am happy to say that we have gone a long way, and we are still in the process of that transformation.
I can tell you that out of the six smart agendas, in every one that you check, we have done at least 60 to 70 per cent of where we want to be.
So, this will change the narrative. And I am happy you are here. You have seen it.
You were in Tsafe for the ground-breaking of a 95-kilometre road project, one of the most troublesome security areas. As a governor, is the security situation improving or escalating? Are you getting the necessary support from the Federal Government?
Everything is based on data. If you ask me this question, comparing what happened a few years ago with what is happening today, particularly the number of people being killed daily before 2023, I will tell you that the number has reduced significantly.
That is one.
You can read further information. The data is there. Even if you don't have it, we have that data.
Tsafe happens to be one of the critical areas where we have serious security challenges because one of the leaders, Ado Aleru, has a gang that is terrorising that area.
Yesterday, we tried to improve our response time in the event of an attack in any of those areas.
The road from Zamfara to Gusau is a troublesome area. Whenever there is an attack, it is very difficult for security personnel to get there within a reasonable timeframe.
We felt that the road should be constructed so that the response time would be quicker.
Access is key to the kind of response people get, and I can tell you that insecurity has gone down drastically.
In the past, almost daily, you would hear that 200 people were being killed or that an entire village had been wiped out.
But go and check the data now. You hardly hear that.
There may be pockets of attacks in some ungoverned areas. And, of course, during the dry season, getting to some of those locations is extremely difficult.
That is why we are employing technology, including drones. We are perfecting the system.
We have started getting information about what is happening and what kind of response time we need in the event of an attack.
Your 'Rescue Mission' promised to rescue Zamfara from non-state armed groups and criminal syndicates. How far have you gone on that/ At what point will your campaign promise become a reality?
Thank you very much. If you compare the data before 2023, before I came on board, with what is happening today, the data is very clear in terms of the rate of insecurity in Zamfara State.
Yes, part of my campaign promises at the time was to work on security, and I am happy to say that I have done so much.
I had not realised the magnitude of the challenge. The first thing I had to do was sit down and think about what would be the best way to handle the situation under the circumstances.
That was what informed my decision as governor to form the Community Protection Guards, known as CPG.
The CPG is our local security outfit that works in collaboration with conventional security officers.
We employed the services of the DSS to carry out the normal vetting. We wanted responsible people with credible histories.
We realised that we could not be everywhere in the 40 communities. Therefore, we identified people within those locations who lived with the people, understood the people and understood the terrain, and recruited them into the CPG. That was exactly what we did.
At the time, we had about 3,000 people.
Do you still believe that negotiation with bandits is certainly not the way to go? How do you convince people that your approach is the right way to go?
Thank you very much for this very important question. I will say this: my stand has always been no negotiation with the bandits, from day one. And I still maintain that stand.
People are going into this because it is more like a business now. Kidnapping people and asking for ransom is empowering the bandits.
For every naira that you pay, that is what they use to acquire sophisticated weapons.
If they don't get the money, where do you think they will get the weapons?
It happened to me in 2025, when two of my blood brothers were kidnapped.
The first thing they asked for was a ransom of N300 million per person. I said I was not going to pay a dime.
You already have these people under your custody. You came to pick them yourselves. They did not go there. They even came to their houses and picked them.
And you expect me to pay money to secure their freedom? I said no. I will not do that.
I am a very strong believer that if they are meant to die within that period, they will die. Nobody will do anything.
But I will not give my money to a criminal and empower him to do more.
Secondly, if you look at the history of all the negotiations that took place under the previous administration, did they yield any positive results? The answer is no.
Remember, these people are not organised. If you decide to negotiate with A, another person will feel that you are underrating him.
He will show you that he is also somebody to recognise.
So, how do you negotiate with these kinds of people? Nobody takes responsibility. Nobody takes leadership. They operate in isolation.
How did the Community Protection Guards contribute to the fight against insecurity?
The first batch went through rigorous training conducted by the DSS, the military and the police, after going through the legislative process that allowed them to legally carry arms.
That was the first thing we did, and it helped in many ways.
They went through three months of compulsory training on how to handle arms, intelligence gathering and other areas, after which they were posted back to their respective communities.
We provided all the necessary logistics, including motorcycles, vehicles, ammunition and other equipment. It helped bring down the rate of attacks in those communities.
There are cases where even conventional security forces would not go in, but because the local CPG members understand the terrain very well, they always lead operations alongside the conventional security forces.
So, that has brought down insecurity in Zamfara drastically, and I am happy with what is happening right now.
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The Federal Government has also empowered us to have forest guards, and we are recruiting from within the communities that live with the people.
Look at the terrain. Let me give you an example of one troublesome area called Anka.
That is a home of banditry in Zamfara.
When I went to Anka, it was about 120 kilometres away, but it took me eight hours to get there.
So, imagine when there is an attack in Anka. How do we get there? What kind of response would you give somebody?
When a governor is travelling to the same area, it took me eight and a half hours to get there. You can imagine how other security personnel would get there.
That is one of the reasons why the first thing I did was to initiate road construction in that area.
I am happy to say that it is near completion now. That way, the response time will be quicker and faster.
Based on all the negotiations that took place with previous governments, was there any meaningful change? And if not, why continue to negotiate with these groups?
The answer is no. Why would I continue to negotiate with people who are not organised, people who don't know the value of life and people who are not educated? How do you convince them? What kind of dialogue are you talking about?
That is why my stand has been no negotiation, and I still do not negotiate and will not negotiate with criminals.
Coming back to political will, I strongly believe that if we have the political will, believe me, give me the control and command structure, and I will end this in two months.
I still maintain that stand. So, yes, political will is an issue.
But I am happy now that people are beginning to realise that we need to do something. Otherwise, there will be no country like Nigeria. Zamfara still happens to be the epicentre of this criminality.
You have argued that Zamfara's insecurity is not just a state problem. How far-reaching is the problem?
All the banditry that you see around Niger, Kaduna, even now beyond Abuja and Kwara, people used to say it was a political statement because I was in the opposition.
When things started happening in Kwara and beyond, now the same criminals are coming there, so we are beginning to realise what we have been going through.
It is not a political statement. It is real. These things are real. It is not limited to Zamfara State. It can affect any state.
As long as we don't control it from here in Zamfara, we will not have an end to banditry and kidnapping in Nigeria.
I have said it. The data is there. It is not a political statement. This is reality.
