Washington, DC — Bush administration officials are pleased at the unanimous condemnation by African nations of the attacks against the World Trade Center and the Pentagon and pledges of support for an anti-terror coalition. Even African nations not usually considered friendly to the United States have offered assistance. Libya's Muammar Gaddafi offered condolences, calling the attacks "horrific." Secretary of State Colin Powell telephoned Sudanese Foreign Minister Osman Mustafa Ismail and asked for his cooperation and received a promise of it.
The U.S. has identified the attackers as committed to an extreme Islamic fundamentalism and many African nations worry about such forces within their own borders. African nations also worry about an angry public backlash directed at Muslims or persons thought to be Muslim in the United States that endangers their citizens. AllAfrica's Charles Cobb Jr. spoke with Walter H. Kansteiner, US Assistant Secretary of State for African Affairs, about these and other matters affecting Africa in the aftermath of the attacks. Excerpts:
Let's start right in with the word 'backlash.' With regard to the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, I have talked to several African embassies and missions in Washington and New York and there is clearly an undertone of worry at potential danger to their people - many of whom are Muslim - because of anger. Is that a concern of your office?
One of the African ambassadors, from an African country that has a very sizeable Muslim population, was in to see me just now. And he said, 'First of all I want to thank you, and particularly President Bush for recognizing the difference between Islam and Bin Laden.' And the symbolic gesture of having a Muslim cleric at the National Cathedral service was very powerful, especially for the African Muslim countries. The first clergyman who stood up and spoke at the cathedral service was a Muslim cleric. Likewise, Tuesday's visit to the Islamic Center, although symbolic, was deeply appreciated and was a significant symbol. So, this Administration is very sensitive to that and we have to make it clear that Islam and Bin Laden are not synonymous.
I think there is less concern about the attitude at official levels such as the President's or the Secretary of State's than there is about the anger of an ordinary person on the street. An Indian Sikh was attacked with a baseball bat in New York because he was wearing a turban. Muslims, many from Africa, feel they need to lay low. Are these kinds of concerns being expressed to you by representatives of African nations since you're the Assistant Secretary of State for African Affairs?
Not to date. No. But again I think there must be a sensitivity. That's part of the appreciation of President Bush and Colin Powell. There is a big difference between the Muslim faith and the actions of a radical terrorist cell. That's what political leaders try to tell -- the American public in this case -- that there are nuances. Important differences. But no, to answer your question, I have not heard from embassies although it would not surprise me that they are concerned about it.
The other dimension to this, of course, is policy. This is a very active period with regard to US policy in Africa. Sudan comes immediately to mind. The United States has just appointed a special envoy to Sudan. Last week the United Nations did not lift sanctions. It seemed to me that the United States was for continuing those sanctions....
It [the Security Council session] never took place. It was actually scheduled for the day of, or the day after, the attack, so all Security Council business got pushed off.
What does this mean for a place like Sudan - clearly an important nation? On the one hand there is still swirling around Sudan the accusation that it is, or certainly has been, a base for terrorists and terrorist actions. On the other hand, the United States is interested in reaching a rapprochement with the Khartoum government.
Well, our first order of business with Sudan is to get their cooperation on counter-terrorism. The most immediate order of business is that. We have lots of other bilateral and regional issues with Sudan relating to the Sudanese conflict and the behavior and conduct that has been exhibited toward Southerners. So we have lots of issues with the government in Khartoum. Right now, the issue that we have to deal with is in fact the counter-terrorist one. And so we have reached out and they have reached out. In fact there were some very interesting statements from the foreign minister concerning wanting to cooperate with the United States -- wanting to cooperate on counter terrorist issues, intelligence issues, even an implied offer to assist in overflight rights and those kinds of staging type issues that might or might not come up. So, I think the first steps have been relatively positive and I think we have to keep making those steps.
Is this a part of [Sudan Special Envoy] Senator Danforth's mission - this discussion - or something separate? You say the first priority is joining with the U.S. in a counter-terrorist effort. Does this shift somewhat Senator Danforth's mission?
This is not really Senator Danforth's mission at all. It relates to his; it will have an impact, undoubtedly. His brief, if you will, is as the Sudan peace coordinator looking to be the special envoy for the coordination of the peace effort between the North and the South. That's his mandate. Obviously it's all one country - I should say it's all one government - and what the government does in Khartoum on counter-terrorism will indirectly affect other issues too. But right now this is not what Senator Danforth is focused on at all.
Now kind of the reverse of Sudan but still within the context of trying to understand Africa in the aftermath of these bombings, Nigeria also comes to mind. In Washington here we have a terrorist act in which the finger is pointed at some kind of radical fringe of Islam at the very moment that in Jos, Nigeria the city is being pulled apart by religious violence. And generally in the North we are witnessing Sharia law. Is this counter-terrorist effort impacting on Nigeria?
I have not gotten full briefings and analysis on it but I think it's fascinating and tragic. The level of violence gives you great concern. I saw one report that suggested that two thousand plus have been killed in the last ten days. Part of that violence seems to have been ignited, or at least was a catalyst of, the terrorist activity in this country which is just a double tragedy. Not only do you have what happened in New York and Washington, but then on top of it, it ignites further violence somewhere else. I think it's one of those very tough, sensitive, Nigerian, domestic issues.
I am asking the question in part because the White House has emphasized a terrorist network that is worldwide and at least the glue that seems to be holding this network together - a network that reaches into many parts of Africa - seems to be some notion of a return to 'fundamental' Islamic values....
I don't see it that way, to be honest. To say that there aren't cells, or whatever you want to describe it - to say that there aren't offshoots and structures that are related to either Bin Laden's organization or other radical terrorist groups - to say that those don't exist in Africa is naive. They probably do exist. To what degree and how extensive they are and how well coordinated they are, I don't think we really know. So, I'm a little cautious on this arc of conspiracy. I've got my real doubts.
Fair enough. But there is the question: What are we looking at as we look at Sharia in Northern Nigeria? When we look at Khartoum? And....
Absolutely. Remember, in grad school when we were all learning to be Africanists it was always called 'the Black-Green line.' And it cut right across the southern Sahel. Historically it's been there and that rivalry, conflict - call it what you want - has historically been a fact of life for decades and centuries.
So we're not at a more dangerous moment with regard to that conflict in your view?
Not in a material sort of way more dangerous than 50 years ago or a hundred years ago. I don't think so. I think we know about it more thanks to CNN and allAfrica.com. I just think that our awareness level is higher.
The Administration has been emphasizing the need to 'fight terrorism' characterizing it as a war. At the same time the Administration has argued in various forums for 'democratic transparency' as the real solution to any number of issues in Africa, any number of states in turmoil. And the two notions seem to be in conflict with one another: the need to fight terrorism and the argument for democratic transparency. How do you resolve that?
It kind of goes back to that old adage that authoritarian governments are stable governments. They are authoritarian and hence can make security happen. In the short term you can probably make a case for that. In the long term you most certainly cannot. In the long term the stable secure countries are ones that are democratic, that have institutions that let the body politic have a voice. They are countries that have independent judicial systems where civil liberties and human rights are protected and private property rights are protected. So in the long term you'll be more effective in fighting terrorism and keeping a stable environment if you have a democratic system than if you have an authoritarian one.
And how do you convey that message, that idea?
That's a toughie. That's hard. And I think that just takes time and you have to continually demonstrate why a free and fair election and why an independent judicial system, and why these checks and balances within a government benefit the body politic. Some of it is very apparent. Obviously if you have a free and fair election the people of a country get to speak and they feel like they have a voice. But in times like this, it's sometimes hard.
How do you, in your capacity, read a population, as distinct from their political leaders, in a place like Egypt or Algeria where, particularly among poor people, there is a fair amount of sympathy for what, for lack of a better term, we might call a militant Islam?
Or take a Russia. You have a fair amount of yearning for that authoritarian Soviet system to come back and give the country some stability, especially in times when you were having terrorist bombings from Chechens in Moscow. There was very much an outcry, from the people if you will, to bring back that authoritarian structure.
I'm asking at bottom whether your work isn't made more difficult by grassroots sympathy for radical Islam?
I think it makes it more difficult for some African countries and some African governments. I think it probably complicates the political horizon. But I don't think it's an impossible complication. I think it's one that most African governments can work through. And I think we're starting to see that.
For example?
I think Tanzania, for instance, is an interesting example. There have been voices within the body politic which have been calling for a more theocratic type of policies and the government has been very adept and very good at acknowledging these concerns and letting that voice be heard but at the same time maintaining political institutions that are proper and democratic.
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How about what from this administration's view might be described as key or critical African states? Nigeria. Egypt. Algeria. South Africa. All of which have been rocked to some extent.
Nigeria and South Africa are the two that are in my bailiwick. Algeria and Egypt are not. Nigeria clearly this week has been dramatic and traumatic as far as the sectarian violence that has gone on. The public statements I have seen that President Obasanjo has made have been very helpful in trying to bring some calm and bring the early seeds of reconciliation. And that is going to have to constantly go on. These are sophisticated political leaders and they know that. This is not a one-speech policy from President Obasanjo. Every day he is working this issue. I think South Africa probably is on a much reduced scale in terms of that kind of conflict although there are very real political sensitivities there too. Cape Town. Durban.
Is your case made stronger as you jockey for more resources, more attention, by this kind of tumult?
It's not that big on the radar screen. What's much more important to us and what's been so satisfying has been the outpouring of not only sympathy, which has been unbelievable from African countries, but equally as important, eagerness to cooperate on the [anti-terror] coalition. We asked all the African ambassadors to come in on Friday and every ambassador from every African nation that has a mission in Washington came.
And what did you ask them?
First of all we thanked them for attending the Cathedral service and thanked them for the sympathies and condolences that were sent by every African country to both President Bush and the American people. But we also thanked them for their eagerness and their willingness to join the coalition against this terrorist threat which every African country has been very affirmative and positive in wanting to assist, wanting to help. Specifically doing things like sharing intelligence, being conscious of borders, flows of people coming in and out; a whole host of issues, some that might come into play in the future and some that might not. The cooperation, the coordination and the willingness to participate in this coalition has been fantastic but also unbelievably reassuring to me as an American. When it really gets tough you really see who your friends are and Africa is very much our friend. That meeting on Friday, it was just humbling to see that support.
Will Africa take a coordinated continental approach to assisting or will it be up to individual countries to assist?
The OAU right now is drafting a resolution supporting the war against terrorism. But in kind of real terms it will be more on a bilateral basis, but it will be coordinated. And there are going to be countries and regions and neighbors that clearly work together with us in the coalition.
